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American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

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Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#151

Post by ep103 »

ngngngng wrote: post #142
SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #116

They already take a high resolution back scatter shot of my genitals on the way in, what's a little more humiliation among friends? If they want to spend 6 hours watching me make pained expressions as I shift and turn and feel the bits that make me human slowly slip away, leaving me a crippled, grunting inhuman beast by the time I get out of the aluminum can full of other peoples farts, I guess they are welcome to it…

For all the crap we give China and their authoritarian government, airport security is FAR easier at every Chinese airport I've been to. Walk through a metal detector and get a quick non-invasive pat down.

Try doing that as a Uyghur

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#152

Post by chiefalchemist »

hiccuphippo wrote: post #115
yters wrote: post #100

It's ironic that in the book 1984 all the citizens have hidden cameras in their TVs. Today, in 2019, all the citizens have non-hidden cameras and microphones in pretty much every electronic device they use. We also have the customary day of rage, where we all direct our collective rage at some political opponent. Don't get me started on the butchering of the English language...

Sorry to nitpick but the cameras in the TVs in 1984 where not hidden. They even had a speaker and the government was able to talk directly to an individual through them. The problem there, and here, is people don't really care.

Caring or not aside, the psychological and emotional "friction" from the constant din of surveillance takes it toll. Worst case, it influences your decisions / behavior to becomes less "suspect". There's no need to care, you've already been assimilated.

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#153

Post by docker_up »

bobthepanda wrote: post #124
hiccuphippo wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry to nitpick but the cameras in the TVs in 1984 where not hidden. They even had a speaker and the government was able to talk directly to an individual through them. The problem there, and here, is people don't really care.

Except people do care, as evidenced by the fact that this is even an article about a controversy in the first place.

Some journalists care. Don't conflate journalists or HN forum with the general public. Most people likely don't care at all.

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#154

Post by kelnos »

bobthepanda wrote: post #127
mcrae wrote: post #120

What's the big deal, though? Its not like these devices are in your home -- they are in a public space that is well known to be heavily surveiled. So I guess, even in the worst case scenario where these cameras were recording you, what is so different from the other 500x camera FOVs you step into during your journey? What am I missing?

An airport is a public space. A plane seat is semi-private or at least has always had that expectation. And given that it was placed there by the people owning the plane, it is well within the bounds of what passengers can expect to demand changed by said owners.

> A plane seat is semi-private or at least has always had that expectation.

Really? I've never had that expectation. I consider it the same as sitting on a seat on a public transit bus or subway train.

I still think the airline should disclose when and how they're recording me, but an expectation of privacy? Nah.

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#155

Post by filmgirlcw »

tensor wrote: post #135
filmgirlcw wrote: post #22

I understand why airlines and other industries are using off-the-shelf parts; I actually prefer this because it gets us closer to more modular IFE systems like what Delta/GoGo are doing on the A220, which means airlines can conceivably upgrade their IFE systems more frequently and at lower costs. What I don’t understand is why there aren’t commodify parts available sans cameras, given the myriad of use-cases and the…

Personally, I want cameras on these things. It's an airplane, not a private space. And a camera is useful for all sorts of things from video conferencing to gesture based interaction.

I said this in another comment, but it really depends on the type of flight and class of cabin you're in. Singapore Airlines has showers in first class. Emirates, Qatar, Singapore, and Air France all have private first-class suites with doors or full-length curtains.

The big trend in international business class (both with US domestic and foreign carriers) is to make the seats as private as possible. Delta has doors on the A350, Qatar does something similar on the QSuite (which can be configured even for four people to have their only little pod and a double bed for couples), and others are following suit.

For those of us who travel extensively for work (especially international travel) and are expected to be ready to go upon landing (I sometimes have meetings or stage rehearsals within ours of landing after a 10+ hour flight -- though I usually try to arrange my travel so I have at least a night before to adjust, that isn't always possible), sleeping on planes is imperative and it's why you pay thousands of dollars for a lay-flat seat in a private cocoon for business class.

Also, people who do video conferencing on airplanes are the worst. The absolute worst. (Unless you're in one of the private first-class suites I'll never be able to afford, then knock yourself out.)

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#156

Post by trophycase »

ngngngng wrote: post #142
SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #116

They already take a high resolution back scatter shot of my genitals on the way in, what's a little more humiliation among friends? If they want to spend 6 hours watching me make pained expressions as I shift and turn and feel the bits that make me human slowly slip away, leaving me a crippled, grunting inhuman beast by the time I get out of the aluminum can full of other peoples farts, I guess they are welcome to it…

For all the crap we give China and their authoritarian government, airport security is FAR easier at every Chinese airport I've been to. Walk through a metal detector and get a quick non-invasive pat down.

Not in my experience. Felt about the same as US security, with one major difference being they made you take all electronics with cords out, such as phone chargers. This was both for international and domestic china flights.

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#157

Post by thfuran »

ep103 wrote: post #151
ngngngng wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For all the crap we give China and their authoritarian government, airport security is FAR easier at every Chinese airport I've been to. Walk through a metal detector and get a quick non-invasive pat down.

Try doing that as a Uyghur

I think you'll find that you're mistaken about any difference you think that would make. Please step this way for re-education.

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#158

Post by bobthepanda »

xfitm3 wrote: post #143
bobthepanda wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An airport is a public space. A plane seat is semi-private or at least has always had that expectation. And given that it was placed there by the people owning the plane, it is well within the bounds of what passengers can expect to demand changed by said owners.

I will never understand this mentality.

Understand what? That public vs. private is a spectrum and not a black and white area? Or that consumers can discover they don't like something about the product they're using and demand changes?

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#159

Post by filmgirlcw »

askvictor wrote: post #45
filmgirlcw wrote: post #22

I understand why airlines and other industries are using off-the-shelf parts; I actually prefer this because it gets us closer to more modular IFE systems like what Delta/GoGo are doing on the A220, which means airlines can conceivably upgrade their IFE systems more frequently and at lower costs. What I don’t understand is why there aren’t commodify parts available sans cameras, given the myriad of use-cases and the…

What's the market for Android tablets (units per year) for airlines, compared to retail? I would suspect retail vastly outnumbers it, hence being considerably cheaper. What other use cases are you thinking of that would have significant volume?

Medical facilities, government (where cameras are almost always disabled at the software/MDM level), any secure area where a front-facing camera isn't ideal.

Military and hospitals alone would strike me as being a big enough market to at least deserve a SKU/option.

Re: American Airlines Has Cameras in Their Screens Too

#160

Post by devinmrn »

filmgirlcw wrote: post #130
devinmrn wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's interesting how the expectation of privacy varies from person to person! Since members of the general public are in close proximity I generally wouldn't consider an airplane cabin a place where I could have a reasonable expectation of privacy. In places that are intentionally restricted from view by others, like my own home, a hotel room, etc. I'd have an expectation of privacy.

Sure -- but that also depends on your class of cabin, your flight length, all kinds of things. I fly a lot for work (I'm already at 67k miles flown for 2019 -- that's actual miles not airline miles (so that 67k is lower than my status miles)) and for anything over 6 hours or so, I fly business (unless I get an upgrade on a short-haul) and have had 6 flights over 10 hours this year, where I tend to have a lay flat bed…

If the $10k tickets provide a private area separated from the other passengers with a partition that prevents observation then I'd expect privacy from being recorded. Likewise in a hotel room, it's a solitary space separate from others and I'd expect privacy from being recorded or observed by employees entering my room. I'd share your same outrage!

However my experience stems from two long haul flights in economy and a handful of domestic flights in the same class. If someone was recording me while I was sleeping there I'd treat it the same as if I was napping under a tree in a national park. I wouldn't be concerned.

If there aren't measures in place to prevent other members of the public from observing then I expect recording is a possibility.

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