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Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

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Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#11

Post by maxxxxx »

nabnob wrote: post #10

This is incredibly worrying. I understand that anti-vax conspiracy theories are dangerous, but I can think of a ton of ways banning "bad medical advice", as determined by a $10/hr contractor at Pinterest, Facebook, etc. could end up hurting people with health problems by preventing them from sharing useful information. I have gender dysphoria and at one point considered getting on testosterone, but thanks to conversa…

I agree. It worries me that public conversation gets policed by companies whose main goal is to sell ads to the highest bidder. By definition they will have to prefer information that makes them money over information that doesn’t make them money. They are also very vulnerable to pressure from governments.

In addition you have no real recourse if the big machine doesn’t like what you posted.

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#12

Post by maxxxxx »

duxup wrote: post #9

Some firms are more on top of it than others. Netflix's deal with Goop is not encouraging, Goop just a "lifestyle brand" that is selling snake oil.

In the end they will always go for more money despite all the talk about values.

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#13

Post by abakker »

maxxxxx wrote: post #12
duxup wrote: post #9

Some firms are more on top of it than others. Netflix's deal with Goop is not encouraging, Goop just a "lifestyle brand" that is selling snake oil.

In the end they will always go for more money despite all the talk about values.

Well, I feel like it is also worth pointing out that all money starts to be a lot more persuasive when your business model is "lose other people's money until a miracle occurs". Honestly, if we have a system which permits/encourages sky-high valuations and seemingly interesting businesses to expand well beyond their user's desires or ability to pay, this is precisely what we get.

If you monetize on ads, you need damn expensive ads. If you want to have expensive ads, you gotta do something to actually make them work.

if sustainability vs valuation was a goal, then there might be more incentive to avoid these kinds of odd, consumer hostile behaviors. Users may not be the product, but, they're not the direct revenue source either. As long as ads can trick people into clicking, there is an incentive to charge for those ads.

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#14

Post by [deleted] »

maxxxxx wrote: post #11
nabnob wrote: post #10

This is incredibly worrying. I understand that anti-vax conspiracy theories are dangerous, but I can think of a ton of ways banning "bad medical advice", as determined by a $10/hr contractor at Pinterest, Facebook, etc. could end up hurting people with health problems by preventing them from sharing useful information. I have gender dysphoria and at one point considered getting on testosterone, but thanks to conversa…

I agree. It worries me that public conversation gets policed by companies whose main goal is to sell ads to the highest bidder. By definition they will have to prefer information that makes them money over information that doesn’t make them money. They are also very vulnerable to pressure from governments. In addition you have no real recourse if the big machine doesn’t like what you posted.

[deleted]

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#15

Post by sandworm101 »

tdb7893 wrote: post #8
kennbutler wrote: post #2

I still feel like large tech companies don't understand the amount of power they wield beyond it's capacity to influence buying decisions. I personally believe that YouTube (pre-2009) was the early breeding ground for conspiracy theorists, and Facebook groups/pages was the enriched gasoline added to the fire.

My father in law is a conspiracy theorist and it came a lot more from Fox News and talk radio than YouTube. They were pretty mainstream well before YouTube

The difference was that 1990s conspiracies were all about secret government agencies doing secret stuff in secret places. Modern conspiracies are out in public. Pizzagate, still belived by many, is different than area 51. This visibility means belief is constantly reenforced.

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#16

Post by C1sc0cat »

maxxxxx wrote: post #11
nabnob wrote: post #10

This is incredibly worrying. I understand that anti-vax conspiracy theories are dangerous, but I can think of a ton of ways banning "bad medical advice", as determined by a $10/hr contractor at Pinterest, Facebook, etc. could end up hurting people with health problems by preventing them from sharing useful information. I have gender dysphoria and at one point considered getting on testosterone, but thanks to conversa…

I agree. It worries me that public conversation gets policed by companies whose main goal is to sell ads to the highest bidder. By definition they will have to prefer information that makes them money over information that doesn’t make them money. They are also very vulnerable to pressure from governments. In addition you have no real recourse if the big machine doesn’t like what you posted.

This is true but its more stopping scammers / snake oil salespersons selling placebo's to desperate people.

I few years ago I reported (to Matt Cuts) people using ppc selling snake oil pills to people with chronic organ failure by buying ppc on the medication keywords that people like me where using.

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#18

Post by TACIXAT »

nabnob wrote: post #10

This is incredibly worrying. I understand that anti-vax conspiracy theories are dangerous, but I can think of a ton of ways banning "bad medical advice", as determined by a $10/hr contractor at Pinterest, Facebook, etc. could end up hurting people with health problems by preventing them from sharing useful information. I have gender dysphoria and at one point considered getting on testosterone, but thanks to conversa…

That was my first thought too, about how this can cut down on new information that isn't supported by medical literature. I have some weird food issues that I can't find any research on. Some people with similar issues go on an all meat diet, which might not be the most nutritionally complete, but it beats the hell out of their regular symptoms. It would be a shame for discussions like that to vanish under the premise that it doesn't match the food pyramid.

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#19

Post by msla »

nabnob wrote: post #10

This is incredibly worrying. I understand that anti-vax conspiracy theories are dangerous, but I can think of a ton of ways banning "bad medical advice", as determined by a $10/hr contractor at Pinterest, Facebook, etc. could end up hurting people with health problems by preventing them from sharing useful information. I have gender dysphoria and at one point considered getting on testosterone, but thanks to conversa…

> I have gender dysphoria and at one point considered getting on testosterone, but thanks to conversations with transmen and detransitioned women on social media, I learned about less-commonly discussed side effects and decided against taking testosterone. This is an area where research is still developing and there aren't a ton of long-term studies, so it's incredibly helpful to be able to learn from other people's experiences, even if they aren't yet confirmed by research.

I'm sorry for using your actual problem as a jumping-off point, but this is a real issue:

There are people called TERFs, or Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminists, who think "being trans" doesn't exist, that trans people are all mentally ill and/or (in the case of transwomen) men trying to invade female spaces to cause havoc, and who are organized enough to turn being trans into a huge political clusterfuck.

More than it already is, I mean.

My point is, the project of cleaning up "Bad Medical Information" runs into politics even quicker than most would imagine, and TERFs are very, very good at playing the "You're misogynistic!" card early, often, and loudly. How much courage would a tech company have in the face of that these days?

(They're also good at playing the "TERF is a slur! Cis is a slur!" card.)

Re: Pinterest Blocks Vaccination Searches in Move to Control the Conversation

#20

Post by MR4D »

nabnob wrote: post #10

This is incredibly worrying. I understand that anti-vax conspiracy theories are dangerous, but I can think of a ton of ways banning "bad medical advice", as determined by a $10/hr contractor at Pinterest, Facebook, etc. could end up hurting people with health problems by preventing them from sharing useful information. I have gender dysphoria and at one point considered getting on testosterone, but thanks to conversa…

It doesn't have to be a $10/hr contractor even - it could be a $500,000 per year MD.

For instance, for years, people recommended a high carb/low fat diet. Now that's being challenged. (I'm not weighing in on the argument, just stating that it is one.)

How would this debate take place if this type of information were blocked? For years (decades?) Atkins was treated as a fringe-food nut job. Now, his early research is being promoted by many others, and the tide may yet turn in his direction. [0] for example only.

How many other topics are out there that face the same issues of being labeled "fringe" before being commonly accepted?

[0] - https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/088307380934759...

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