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Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

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101–110 of 165 posts

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#101
And the greatest trick Keyser Söze ever pulled was convincing women, men have the better deal working full time and not spending time with the children and we should literally campaign telling them they are wrong not to want to work full time and the small benefits you get from that over the lifelong reward of bringing up healthy caring children.

But it is best for society... and other suckers not you if they work. Shug, so what's to complain about?

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#102

I have yet to be told why it is important for there to be as many women in STEM as men apart from statements that I'm sexist for not knowing

For the same reason its important for there to be as many women in mining, oil rigging, heavy industry, and forestry.

Are you being facetious? Obviously labor intensive work does not reap the same benefits from diversity of perspectives as scientific or creative fields.

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#103

I have yet to be told why it is important for there to be as many women in STEM as men apart from statements that I'm sexist for not knowing

Because it's hard to tell who is going to make the next big leap. Losing 25% of the top brain power because we cannot be bothered to organise crèches seems shortsighted

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henrietta_Swan_Leavitt

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#104
post #53
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because I think it's the only way we have to measure that there are no cultural barriers for women entering STEM professions. I've often theorized that much of the widely talked about pay gap has to do with either professions that women often wish to work in - or that society steers them to - but I dont know enough to know if its personal preference, or sociocultural bias driving personal preference. In the end, pay…

Actually, women are favored for tenure track STEM jobs: https://www.educationnews.org/higher-education/study-women-f... So yes, there is sexism in academic STEM hiring: 2:1 in favor of women.

[deleted]

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#105
I wonder what % of these cases could be explained by understanding how much money each parent is making.

I'd wager that US Female Scientists probably make less than their partners. I'd wager that it's more likely for a US Female Scientist to stay in her position when she makes more money than her partner.

Do US Female Scientists have a preference for starting families with those who out-earn them?

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The closer your field's demographics are to your society's, the lower the risk of (unconscious) bias is. That's only true if all biases cancel each other out perfectly.

No, because this isn't a binary result. If group a and b both have bias 1, that bias won't be cancelled. But if they differ on bias 2, the combined group has less bias than a or b while not having 'cancelled all biases perfectly'. Perfection is a false goal while 'lower risk' is attainable and worthwhile.

Fair enough, let's forget the word "perfectly". Let's have a "practical" example. A society is made up of 99% "ethnic Germans" and 1% Jews. The year is 1933.

A faculty is made up of 90% "ethnic Germans" and 10% Jews. According to the hypothesis, getting that makeup closer to the societal demographics will result in a "lower risk of bias".

I hope it is now obvious to see that the hypothesis is a non-sequitur.

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#107
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're comfortable, could you describe some of your experiences facing sexism? Did you experience this after you released information that you're a divorced parent?

I have a Certificate in GIS. I worked at a Fortune 500 company for over 5 years in a Pink Collar Ghetto department. I wanted a job in the IT department, where jobs generally paid better. In all the years I worked there, I met only one person who knew what GIS was without me having to explain it. He was a senior programmer in the department I wanted a job in. He asked me for a date, thereby making it vastly less likel…

To be honest it sounds like you just have unreasonable expectations about the way things work, and choose to look at everything from a negative perspective.

Maybe readjusting the way you view things would make you happier, because it sure sounds like you have a siege mentality.

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#108
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're comfortable, could you describe some of your experiences facing sexism? Did you experience this after you released information that you're a divorced parent?

I have a Certificate in GIS. I worked at a Fortune 500 company for over 5 years in a Pink Collar Ghetto department. I wanted a job in the IT department, where jobs generally paid better. In all the years I worked there, I met only one person who knew what GIS was without me having to explain it. He was a senior programmer in the department I wanted a job in. He asked me for a date, thereby making it vastly less likel…

Doreen, what jobs do men with similar to your skills get? What skills do you work on to improve your chances? Do you believe you have expressed well enough to the requiter your willingness to contribute and help move the organization further?

On a side note, I come from a place where we had communism and as a consequence women in science are marginally a majority (the country is Bulgaria). The vast majority (80%) of the IT reqruiters here are female and despite of that they still target, interview and hire 90% of the times male candidates. I really wish I could tell if the cause is prejudice or merit, but I can't.

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#109
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a Certificate in GIS. I worked at a Fortune 500 company for over 5 years in a Pink Collar Ghetto department. I wanted a job in the IT department, where jobs generally paid better. In all the years I worked there, I met only one person who knew what GIS was without me having to explain it. He was a senior programmer in the department I wanted a job in. He asked me for a date, thereby making it vastly less likel…

To be honest it sounds like you just have unreasonable expectations about the way things work, and choose to look at everything from a negative perspective. Maybe readjusting the way you view things would make you happier, because it sure sounds like you have a siege mentality.

I've barely eaten for six days because I'm so broke. I said so in the comment.

I don't doubt that I sound particularly negative in the comment, but your comment amounts to monstrous callousness of exactly the sort that fosters my negative perspective.

Re: Nearly Half of US Female Scientists Leave Full-Time Science After First Child

#110
post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The answer is a quick Google search away, diversity increases innovation: https://www.google.com/search?q=diversity+increases+innovati... If you don't agree with that, I'd love to hear why, and why the related studies are false. Can start with this one, which is the first result: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.685... There's quite the bibliography to pour through there, though, if you really…

The study you linked has nothing to do with gender or diversity w.r.t. minorities. It's subject is economic geography. We can be pretty confident that if 50% of the population are women then 50% of the best candidates for a given job, by natural aptitude, are women. The same logic applies to minorities as well, so we can be confident that any process calibrated to finding the best person for the job is going to turn…

> We can be pretty confident that if 50% of the population are women then 50% of the best candidates for a given job, by natural aptitude, are women

No, that's a false statement. We cannot remotely think that because it's completely wrong. The percentage of population of a gender has nothing remotely to do with the percentage of women qualified for any particular job.

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