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Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

nytimes.com

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Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#531

Post by anth_anm »

spookybones wrote: post #228
jhall1468 wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's absolutely no way they are scaling up NY to the same degree they would have with the subsidies. There's no reason to. The value proposition is gone, so now Amazon will slow-roll growth in NY like they will any other office. The fact that you (and many others) consider this a win is an attempt to revise history. This tax deal was all about Amazon expanding very quickly. That deal is gone. But feel free to pat…

You seem to have no understanding of local culture or the present state of Manhattan and Brooklyn as already massively gutted by wealthy transplants. Ask the majority of people who grew up in San Francisco and Seattle. This is a win. You also seem to have little understanding of the current situation of the NYC subway system infrastructure. You could argue Amazon’s workforce would have forced improvements, except thi…

As someone in Seattle, what excites me about this is Amazon hopefully thinking twice about trying to extort subsidies Boeing style.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#532

Post by nodesocket »

marrone12 wrote: post #524
nodesocket wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you really think Amazon was only going to hire people that already had wealth. It's not possible that somebody making $50k a year, could land a great new position at Amazon making $150k? Cortez is shooting her democrat constituents in the foot, and living up to her affiliation of democratic-socialist.

That's not what happens though. Amazon would be recruiting people from Ivy League schools, big consulting firms, other large tech companies.

Disagree, this constant propagation of rigged system or unfair game is not accurate. I know lots of people who came from very little and were able to work themselves up to economic success. In fact many of the people on the Fobes list came from poor upbringing and backgrounds.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#533

Post by CPLX »

quxbar wrote: post #372
CPLX wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New York does gain something, the much more vibrant and robust collection of businesses that will occupy that area instead and pay their fair share of taxes.

You really have no idea what LIC is like, do you? They're completely unable to support small businesses except those that cater to the upper-middle class. There is no dollar slice, only $24 gluten-free artisanal pizza. The only business Amazon was going to displace was Citibank.

I can literally see LIC right now from my window.

If you're tired of $24 pizza consider the cabbie serving south asian places along 21st street, they're fantastic, and yes they're still there.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#534

Post by jfnixon »

mav3rick wrote: post #400
siruncledrew wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon's spectacle reminds me of Lebron's "The Decision". It's one thing to work out the details and make an announcement, but to purposefully turn it into a show about "What can you do for me?" instead of "Here's what I can do for you" made it not sit well with people. Also, the pull-out letter also basically dumps the blame on state/local officials for not wanting Amazon, despite not all stakeholders being present…

LeBron's Decision 1 was a lot of money for him. He had the talent to back that up.

And the company that owns vast swaths of cloud computing space doesn't have talent to back it up? Amazon is way more dominant than LeBron in their respective businesses.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#535

Post by heyjudy »

phjesusthatguy3 wrote: post #485
raiyu wrote: post #70

After being a resident of NYC for 30 years and seeing the city change and become a technology hub and just a financial center I think this is a real loss for NYC. It would also be in Long island City which would provide a huge influx of new workers and move that neighborhood forward in development rapidly. The down side would be that it would push some residents and business owners out but this is simply a fact of li…

We're all going to have to do something for the people at the actual bottom once we cater to the people racing to the bottom. The people that can't afford to live at the bottom of NYC also can't afford to move their families to Central African Republic and run the tshirt machines producing stuff they ship back where they came from. The USA already has a tax structure in place. Amazon could afford to pay the existing…

UBI, livable wages, raise estate and corporate taxes, operable unions without "right to work" (for less) / union-busting laws, more worker-owned co-ops and integrated standard-of-living net that lifts instead of treating people like criminals.

But first, getting rid of the corporate capture of both major political parties, elected officials, government and policy-making is a precondition to do anything to reverse the neoliberal, cannibalistic anarcho-capitalism inverted totalitarianism being forced on us.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#536

Post by RPLong »

sotojuan wrote: post #451
ianstallings wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Truth. I took a lower paying job in the midwest, and I can now save a lot more money, while also living a less stressful life. NYC is a really cool city and I enjoyed living there. But I "did my time". I think more and more tech workers are going to wake up to the fact that while mega-city life can be cool, it's not the only way to live.

I’m not sure why tech workers think they’re special. Almost everyone that moves to NYC for a good office job goes through this. Moving to a suburb or another city after age 35 is a stereotype. So is staying here and enjoying a DINK or single life (unless you have a lot of money!). Job-wise, the NYC tech market is as good as ever.

Well, technically it's not as good as it was yesterday...

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#537

Post by wgerard »

saemil wrote: post #515
wgerard wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At some point, New Yorkers ought to ask themselves why everyone wants to move to these nice midwestern cities. Not sure why you chose the midwest as a qualifier here - out of all the cities you listed, only Omaha would be considered a midwestern city. Out of the 15 fastest growing cities according to the Census, almost none of them are in the midwest [1] (Only one really: Columbus). Admittedly it's over a short tim…

Columbus is considered the midwest? It is North and EAST of Nashville.

Ohio is definitely considered the midwest.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#538

Post by threatofrain »

koheripbal wrote: post #488
tytso wrote: post #450

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The opposition is not because some high tech firm, whether it is Google or Amazon, is expanding in NYC. The opposition is because of the Massive tax breaks and other $$$ giveaways New York was going to hand over to Amazon. I don't recall Google extorting NYC for $$$ before they decided to expand....

A "tax break" is just a reduction in taxes that otherwise wouldn't be paid at all . It still means a profit for the city. It's not like NYC is paying Amazon to come to NYC. NYC would still make huge tax revenues from additional sales, real estate, income taxes, and corporate taxes. Now they're turning that all away. It's such an irrational decision that if I were Amazon, it would raise a big red flag for me as well.…

Taxes collected increases revenue for NYC; to speak of "profit" we'd have to account for the cost to collect that revenue from Amazon.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#539

Post by pzone »

fastball wrote: post #408
marcell wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how do you fix the rail system? With money from... taxes... from well paid workers, for example. I think a lot of people get so caught up in hating on tech workers and opposing gentrification they forget where the money comes from.

The average employee in that 25k cohort would need to be paying $12k worth of state taxes to NY every year for ten years in order to recoup the $3B tax break figure.

1. New York State has a high tax burden. They don't just collect income taxes - they also collect property, sales and capital gains. $12k per year all-in for a high income worker is pretty typical when you account for these additional taxes. 2. Amazon inc. will also be paying taxes. It doesn't fall entirely on individuals. 3. Ten years isn't that long for a four hundred year old city.

Seems like an clean net positive for the city even viewed in the shallowest of accounting terms. This doesn't include the positive network effects of encouraging the future growth of Amazon and other tech companies in the area.

Re: Amazon Pulls Out of Planned New York City Campus

#540

Post by eanzenberg »

clydethefrog wrote: post #482
nodesocket wrote: post #460

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just don't understand the logic of politicians such as Ocasio-Cortez. Amazon HQ was going to bring 25,000 high paying jobs to the area, providing growth and opportunities for her constituents. Her argument against is that the Amazon HQ would further gentrification and she was appalled by the government subsidies. So she'd rather limit new growth, prevent new jobs, and stifle wealth to prevent luxury condos and Star…

Gentrification is the opposite of people moving up the economic ladder - it's the influx of more affluent residents.

Actually no, gentrification causes existing homeowners to increase their property values. It literally gives the existing community the opportunity to move up the economic ladder.
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