Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

What would a EvE online Internet look like?

blog.benjojo.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 50 posts

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#41

Post by teh_klev »

azdacha wrote: post #25
felixfoertsch wrote: post #4

I love reading about EvE once in a while. It's almost as if there were a completely different space world out there with unlimited freedom and unlimited possibilities. I always feel the urge to join this world and explore it -- but then I come to the realization that it probably needs an exuberant amount of time and dedication to partake in these news worthy event and that most of the time it's probably a grind.

Hi, Eve is really hard to play alone, it's mesmerizing and it's a great experience to try. But once you get addicted to some feeling it creates, I urge to join a corporation with well experienced and active people which will be able to let you earn more in a shorter and more social way. My Eve reality is that I mostly tchat on Discord with my friends while killing some stuff to buy ships / licence / whatever and watc…

> I urge to join a corporation with well experienced and active people

Absolutely this ^^^

After a couple of months learning the basics I joined a mostly UK based corp who's members had been around since the inception of Eve back in the early 2000's. This was around the time Eve introduced the faction war update (Empyrean Age - 2008) and these guys wanted to encourage new players to do PVP but in safer non-null sec space, which the faction warfare update was sort of intended to do.

Being in my early 40's at the time I wasn't a hugely "social gamer", however it turns out many committed Eve players are in that older demographic (30's or older I'd reckon) and many of us had the same interests and senses of humour.

To cut a long story short, I had an absolute whale of a time with these folks (Dark Rising - who're still around operating back out in null-sec again) for a year or so. I don't think I've laughed so hard such as at the times we had spies...on TeamSpeak...in opposing faction corps and they had no clue we'd infiltrated them. The game really took over my life for a while and was amazing fun, and the way to have that kinda fun is to join a corp.

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#42

Post by teh_klev »

bloopernova wrote: post #16

My networking knowledge ends slightly before BGP gets involved, but that article was fascinating. I love that sort of thing, looking at one domain and saying "what if we treated it like this domain?" and then actually doing it! Really awesome stuff.

Grab yourself a copy of Sam Halabi's "Internet Routing Architectures" (2nd Edition).

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/157870233X/

It's likely a bit out of date these days, but it's one of the best books on BGP I'd read back in the day when I was involved with building an internet exchange point circa 1999.

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#43

Post by skrowl »

stcredzero wrote: post #36
felixfoertsch wrote: post #4

I love reading about EvE once in a while. It's almost as if there were a completely different space world out there with unlimited freedom and unlimited possibilities. I always feel the urge to join this world and explore it -- but then I come to the realization that it probably needs an exuberant amount of time and dedication to partake in these news worthy event and that most of the time it's probably a grind.

unlimited freedom and unlimited possibilities Unless you become a lackey of a powerful group, you can't set out for a new frontier without the expectation that another powerful outside group will come along and wreck and/or steal what you've spent time and treasure to build. Wormhole space was designed to break this pattern. However, people have recently figured out how to invade and break those places as well. The o…

The powerful groups in EvE will also require that you have at least a year worth of skill points before they'll take you.

A literal real life year worth. Not kidding.

Skills level up in EvE even while offline, and there's not way to increase them other than the passage of time (except by leveling up other skills that decrease the learning points needed for new skills, but still).

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#44

Post by bloopernova »

teh_klev wrote: post #42
bloopernova wrote: post #16

My networking knowledge ends slightly before BGP gets involved, but that article was fascinating. I love that sort of thing, looking at one domain and saying "what if we treated it like this domain?" and then actually doing it! Really awesome stuff.

Grab yourself a copy of Sam Halabi's "Internet Routing Architectures" (2nd Edition). https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/157870233X/ It's likely a bit out of date these days, but it's one of the best books on BGP I'd read back in the day when I was involved with building an internet exchange point circa 1999.

Thank you, I will add that to my wishlist, plus let my spouse know to look for that in 2nd hand form when she hits various booksellers.

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#45

Post by chillee »

brianpgordon wrote: post #28

Years ago I looked into treating pathfinding in EVE as a graph problem because I was annoyed by losing money in the collapse of the Mt. Gox scam and read that its owner had solved the same problem. I thought I'd show him up by showing how easy it is to blow his terrible PHP code out of the water. :) You can find the writeup and a link to the code on my blog: https://briangordon.github.io/2014/03/better-pathfinding.ht…

Just a note, unless you have negative edges, running V Dijkstra's is likely to perform better than Floyd Warshall. Dijkstra's gives you distance from a single node to all other nodes in V log E time. If you run it V times, you'll get V^2 log E, a substantial improvement upon V^3.

It also seems to me like it's likely to be easier parallelized, considering that the V runs of Dijkstra are completely independent.

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#46

Post by teh_klev »

bloopernova wrote: post #44
teh_klev wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Grab yourself a copy of Sam Halabi's "Internet Routing Architectures" (2nd Edition). https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/157870233X/ It's likely a bit out of date these days, but it's one of the best books on BGP I'd read back in the day when I was involved with building an internet exchange point circa 1999.

Thank you, I will add that to my wishlist, plus let my spouse know to look for that in 2nd hand form when she hits various booksellers.

You're very welcome :)

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#47

Post by stcredzero »

skrowl wrote: post #43
stcredzero wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

unlimited freedom and unlimited possibilities Unless you become a lackey of a powerful group, you can't set out for a new frontier without the expectation that another powerful outside group will come along and wreck and/or steal what you've spent time and treasure to build. Wormhole space was designed to break this pattern. However, people have recently figured out how to invade and break those places as well. The o…

The powerful groups in EvE will also require that you have at least a year worth of skill points before they'll take you. A literal real life year worth. Not kidding. Skills level up in EvE even while offline, and there's not way to increase them other than the passage of time (except by leveling up other skills that decrease the learning points needed for new skills, but still).

A literal real life year worth. Not kidding.

I remember when I was a noob in Eve. There was a caper involving some billions of ISK in the official magazine, and I was in low-sec and saw one of the characters from the article. We hid out in the station in fear. After awhile, one of us asked one of them, if we ran for it, if they'd try and kill us, and they were like, nah, you're good.

Later in corp chat, we were telling about our run in with characters so infamous, people wrote articles about them printed on actual paper!

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#48

Post by jdougan »

skrowl wrote: post #43
stcredzero wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

unlimited freedom and unlimited possibilities Unless you become a lackey of a powerful group, you can't set out for a new frontier without the expectation that another powerful outside group will come along and wreck and/or steal what you've spent time and treasure to build. Wormhole space was designed to break this pattern. However, people have recently figured out how to invade and break those places as well. The o…

The powerful groups in EvE will also require that you have at least a year worth of skill points before they'll take you. A literal real life year worth. Not kidding. Skills level up in EvE even while offline, and there's not way to increase them other than the passage of time (except by leveling up other skills that decrease the learning points needed for new skills, but still).

Your information is years out of date. There are now alternate ways to acquire skill points quickly (injectors) and since the cultural revolution and the rise of the F2P accounts there has been a new appreciation of new players in Eve. Most large groups now have some form of new player program in place, often a corporation, (eg. Brand Newbros, Karmafleet) and in the largest cases they have full on newbro alliances (eg. Pandemic Horde, Brave Newbies, etc.)

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#49

Post by brianpgordon »

chillee wrote: post #45
brianpgordon wrote: post #28

Years ago I looked into treating pathfinding in EVE as a graph problem because I was annoyed by losing money in the collapse of the Mt. Gox scam and read that its owner had solved the same problem. I thought I'd show him up by showing how easy it is to blow his terrible PHP code out of the water. :) You can find the writeup and a link to the code on my blog: https://briangordon.github.io/2014/03/better-pathfinding.ht…

Just a note, unless you have negative edges, running V Dijkstra's is likely to perform better than Floyd Warshall. Dijkstra's gives you distance from a single node to all other nodes in V log E time. If you run it V times, you'll get V^2 log E, a substantial improvement upon V^3. It also seems to me like it's likely to be easier parallelized, considering that the V runs of Dijkstra are completely independent.

Hmm, wouldn't Dijkstra's be V E + V^2 log V? I take your point though. I suspect that I was dazzled by the cache locality advantages of dynamic programming and skeptical that messing about with a bunch of heap nodes would be faster, but looking at it now I bet you're right that knocking one of those Vs down to a log V would help. Thanks for the feedback!

Re: What would a EvE online Internet look like?

#50

Post by kkarakk »

ethbro wrote: post #15
kkarakk wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Games as a service tend to optimise for these kinds of players because they are the whales that pour obscene amounts of money into the game. it's part of why i refuse to buy into any game that sells itself as a "platform". also the balance tends to suck in these games - how do you balance for someone who can basically put 8 hours a day every day in the game and someone who can log on for maybe 2 hours a week(if they'…

> also i may be nitpicking at this point but eve hasn't really evolved their tech stack for how popular they are The last I heard (~10 years ago), they were heavily into Stackless Python. And I believe they did things since then (micro-sharding zones and global time dilation?). There's only so many things you can do with a real-time single world with arbitrary 3D positioning.

still runs like it was deployed on an AWS nano instance when events are happening though
Post reply on HN