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Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

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Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#651

Post by daemin »

mxfh wrote: post #325
rafiki6 wrote: post #110

More evidence as to why tipping culture needs to die. Tipping fundamentally takes away the responsibility of paying someone for their work from the employer to the customer. In what other business context do I pay an employee of a company I deal with directly outside of the service industry where tipping is common? Wages are a cost of doing business. Pay the worker enough. If you want to still provide them an incenti…

Tipping is the "trickle down"-myth's small scale cousin. It doesn't only take away responsibility of paying, but adds emotional and mental load cost to the customer. It's hilarious that people accept that in exchange for an illusory level of control (you being the mini manager/boss of your service task) over quality of service.

I think it's easier to keep the tipping culture because everyone in the USA is already used to having extra random fees added to the sticker price of things.

In places where the tax and all other costs are already factored into the price, tipping is reserved for truly exceptional service.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#652

Post by 52-6F-62 »

throwaway415415 wrote: post #459
rafiki6 wrote: post #110

More evidence as to why tipping culture needs to die. Tipping fundamentally takes away the responsibility of paying someone for their work from the employer to the customer. In what other business context do I pay an employee of a company I deal with directly outside of the service industry where tipping is common? Wages are a cost of doing business. Pay the worker enough. If you want to still provide them an incenti…

There has been a no tipping movement in san francisco that has worked quite well. People don't tip anymore here and it is not socially accepted to do it.

I was in SF on a layover last October. Definitely tipped on our lunch and a beer downtown. But maybe that just outed us as foreigners. We didn’t get any odd treatment for it, either.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#653

Post by afterburner »

parthdesai wrote: post #544
afterburner wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and Canada. Expected tip amounts have also been going up, I assume now because companies/restaurants want to hide a price rise behind it.

hide a price rise? Food prices have gone up since increase in minimum wage last year, and default tip option is 18% at majority of the places. Oh and that 18% counts the 13% tax, so you are tipping more than 18%.

Hide as in not raise the menu prices as much, by letting expected tips go up, letting tips pay for more of the cost.

The end result is of course higher prices, but the sticker shock is lower on the menu.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#654

Post by zymhan »

kkotak wrote: post #249
mrgordon wrote: post #8

Instacart started out by secretly marking up groceries. Once that game was played out, it seems they started secretly marking down employee (oh sorry, contractor) wages

Frankly I can't fathom how this company is still in business. I live in the bay area and I don't know a single person who's ever used it or mentions it.

Well in Atlanta for example, it's either Instacart or Prime Now, and Prime Now from Whole Foods is about the worst grocery delivery service possible. Mostly because you maybe get half of what you ordered.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#655

Post by 52-6F-62 »

silencio wrote: post #251
kojeovo wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The restaurants, like the grocery stores in Instacart's case, determine the cost of food in their respective apps.

this is not always true. my restaurant was listed on doordash without my permission or request, with a butchered menu and completely incorrect prices. multiple requests asking them to at least fix this info or take me off the platform altogether (because customers were starting to wonder why my prices were so low on doordash - they're not, the couriers paid the current amount in-store...) and they ignored me. it wasn…

I heard of this happening in Canada as well.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#656

Post by peteretep »

mannykannot wrote: post #564
thaumasiotes wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I, as a tipper, feel that I have been defrauded when this happens It is standard (though not universal) practice for restaurant staff to pool and divide tips, which would appear to be the same thing from a defrauding-the-tipper perspective. I'm more upset about this line from Instacart: > We include tips in the calculation [of pay for deliveries] so that you can get a more accurate picture of what your earnings wil…

There are issues with tip pooling, but there's one thing that I am absolutely sure of: my tip was not intended for the person's employer, and certainly not for anyone who claims to have arranged for the work to be done by a nominally self-employed contractor.

There's the crux. People may or may not think that their tip is going into a pool, but people definitely do not think that their tip is them saying to the establishment itself "I wish you'd charged me more!"

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#657

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

lenticular wrote: post #117
Gibbon1 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same rules for should apply to wage theft as ordinary theft, more than $950 and it's a felony.

This isn't wage theft since they are independent contractors. It's more like a company stiffing a supplier. More of a civil than criminal matter. Of course, these folks wouldn't have the resources to sue anyway, even if they weren't bound by binding arbitration.

> This isn't wage theft since they are independent contractors. It's more like a company stiffing a supplier.

Why do you keep saying things to this affect?

A company stiffing a supplier is going to rapidly find themselves without suppliers, or the supplier can afford to / accounts for being stiffed on some orders.

An independent contractor who works for one, or maybe two very similar types of, company is very much like an employee in every way that matters to that individual “independent” contractor, and literally nothing like a B2B supplier.

Additionally, you seem preoccupied with existing legislation as though it has some higher virtue, whereas in reality the law can be, and frequently is, unjust and absurd.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#658

Post by sametmax »

xmonkee wrote: post #604
sametmax wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see any link between what I said and capitalism. Thinking of the policical and societal impact of your day to day actions does not only largely go beyong economy, but also doesn't assume the nature of the economic system you are in. The instacart topic is just an example. An example saying, "if your economic system is currently capitalistic, and based on money, then voting with your wallet makes sense". > I u…

> That's so condescending. I was quoting you from the previous comment

Not the "hard" part. The "try to imagine".

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#659

Post by wilkskyes »

askafriend wrote: post #590
wilkskyes wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It wasn't rhetorical and I really would have been interested in the OP's answer. Had they answered truthfully, it would have helped expanded my understanding of how some people think. Instead I've been assaulted and my eyes blackened all for what, because I asked a question that if answered may weaken the credibility of the op's original post?

I think you need to take a step back and truly reflect to take in some of the feedback people have given you here. Egos tend to expand to protect themselves, only to a person's detriment. Your question was not well asked. At all. It carried a ton of baggage with it, made several assumptions, and generalized a whole class of people in society and you seem to be extremely oblivious to it. This isn't meant as an insult.…

If I could go back, knowing what I know now, I don't think I would have asked the question. I was a fool to think I could get any sort of simple response.

Re: Instacart paying 80 cents an hour because worker received a large tip

#660

Post by tchaffee »

gbear605 wrote: post #428
tchaffee wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's quite a broad generalization. For sure a lot of the biggest names have done ethically questionable things. It's no doubt that growing that fast and gaining that much power is going to hugely amplify whatever ethical flaws the founders have. And no one is ethically perfect. That's not to excuse Uber, Facebook, Google, Amazon or any of the more egregious companies. But it's just a case of confirmation bias if yo…

WhatsApp is owned by Facebook as of 2014, so unfortunately all the same issues with Facebook apply to them too.

I agree that folks have very good reason to keep a much closer eye on what WhatsApp actually does, and also what the user agreement says. However, you can't say that the WhatsApp team or product is necessarily and already violating people's privacy in the same ways as Facebook is. You can have all the healthy skepticism you want, but it doesn't mean that WhatsApp is doing those things.
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