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Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

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Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#21

Post by scarface74 »

pjmlp wrote: post #20
scarface74 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming that you don’t have other obligations like family, hobbies, etc. I specifically optimize the limited amount of free time I have to devote to career self improvement to what is going to help me be more competitive in the job market.

Having the skills of being able to bring new ideas into existing software stacks, without forcing the business to lose money with yet another rewrite of the month, is exactly one way of being more competitive in the job market.

For example, if I wanted to bring the ideas of functional programming to a C# shop, why not just learn the concepts of functional programming in C#?

On top of that, if there is a standard way to structure a program in a given language, you’re not doing future developers and maintainers any favors by not following the paradigms of that language or “you can write COBOL in any language”.

When I’m writing on Python, I try to do things in the “Pythonic” way. The same with JS or C#.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#22

Post by TomVDB »

spir wrote: post #5

This link compares search volume for Scala, Rust, and Kotlin for past 12 months in U.S. https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?geo=US&q=%2Fm%2F091... (Scala wins by a large margin!) Awhile ago I chose Scala for a multi-year side project. I love writing Scala. I think the Scala community is quietly productive and mostly talks to themselves. I'm not a Scala expert by any means, but I have have been programming for aw…

One the things I really don’t like about Scala is yet-another-obscure-build system.

I’m forced to use sbt and I don’t like it. And from my reading of my Scala book, the scala compiler is running in some kind of daemon or server instead of a stand-alone compile?

I hate it when so much stuff happens in the background and you can’t figure out what it is.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#23

Post by Matthias247 »

> I wanted to branch into the Java ecosystem but having prior experience in Java, I was not a fan of the syntax.

Independent of the question around Scala: If you want to get into the JVM ecosystem, you should also be able to understand and write Java. Some dependencies will not be available natively in a secondary language like Scala. And it will also give a better understanding about the limitations of the underlying platform.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#24

Post by pjmlp »

scarface74 wrote: post #21
pjmlp wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having the skills of being able to bring new ideas into existing software stacks, without forcing the business to lose money with yet another rewrite of the month, is exactly one way of being more competitive in the job market.

For example, if I wanted to bring the ideas of functional programming to a C# shop, why not just learn the concepts of functional programming in C# ? On top of that, if there is a standard way to structure a program in a given language, you’re not doing future developers and maintainers any favors by not following the paradigms of that language or “you can write COBOL in any language”. When I’m writing on Python, I t…

Lets take Python as example.

async/await only came to it after the success it had on .NET.

So one could have toyed with async/await in C#, and now already understand some best practices to apply in Python.

Or read the Osaki's book on persistent data structures and implement similar ones in a Python library for concurrent code in Python.

Or maybe one has spent a couple of days learning about OCaml and Haskell, and is in a better position to understand how to make better use of list and generator comprehensions or itertools package.

Of course one also has the choice of only eating what is on the plate, without understanding the variations that the same ingredients allow for.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#25

Post by papaf »

TomVDB wrote: post #22
spir wrote: post #5

This link compares search volume for Scala, Rust, and Kotlin for past 12 months in U.S. https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?geo=US&q=%2Fm%2F091... (Scala wins by a large margin!) Awhile ago I chose Scala for a multi-year side project. I love writing Scala. I think the Scala community is quietly productive and mostly talks to themselves. I'm not a Scala expert by any means, but I have have been programming for aw…

One the things I really don’t like about Scala is yet-another-obscure-build system. I’m forced to use sbt and I don’t like it. And from my reading of my Scala book, the scala compiler is running in some kind of daemon or server instead of a stand-alone compile? I hate it when so much stuff happens in the background and you can’t figure out what it is.

I’m forced to use abt and I don’t like it.

You don't have to use SBT. Maven works fine with Scala and is quite mainstream.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#26

Post by cutler »

Here in the UK and London demand for Scala is very close to the demand for Ruby. If you search Indeed.co.uk by title there are around 162 jobs each for Scala and Ruby in the UK, with 65 for Go. Scala's other rival is non-Android Kotlin which has only recently edged into double figures.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#27

Post by scarface74 »

pjmlp wrote: post #24
scarface74 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For example, if I wanted to bring the ideas of functional programming to a C# shop, why not just learn the concepts of functional programming in C# ? On top of that, if there is a standard way to structure a program in a given language, you’re not doing future developers and maintainers any favors by not following the paradigms of that language or “you can write COBOL in any language”. When I’m writing on Python, I t…

Lets take Python as example. async/await only came to it after the success it had on .NET. So one could have toyed with async/await in C#, and now already understand some best practices to apply in Python. Or read the Osaki's book on persistent data structures and implement similar ones in a Python library for concurrent code in Python. Or maybe one has spent a couple of days learning about OCaml and Haskell, and is…

The question is, who has the time?

I already have a two to three year agenda to improve up the stack ($cool_kids_front_end framework of the week), down the stack (AWS cloud infrastructure from a developer, infrastructure, devops viewpoint), more breadth at certain levels (get better at Python, big data, ElasticSearch and Kibana) and staying fluent when it comes to architecture (scalability, high availability, security, etc). Why would I take the time that doesn’t help in that goal?

I don’t need to be an expert in all of those areas, but I at least need to be good at some, average at some, and be conversant in other areas to at least know the what if I don’t know the how to be able to command higher than market salaries as either “adult supervision” at smaller companies or an overpriced consultant - and I am not talking about Silicon Valley/West coast salaries.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#28

Post by pjmlp »

scarface74 wrote: post #27
pjmlp wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lets take Python as example. async/await only came to it after the success it had on .NET. So one could have toyed with async/await in C#, and now already understand some best practices to apply in Python. Or read the Osaki's book on persistent data structures and implement similar ones in a Python library for concurrent code in Python. Or maybe one has spent a couple of days learning about OCaml and Haskell, and is…

The question is, who has the time? I already have a two to three year agenda to improve up the stack ($cool_kids_front_end framework of the week), down the stack (AWS cloud infrastructure from a developer, infrastructure, devops viewpoint), more breadth at certain levels (get better at Python, big data, ElasticSearch and Kibana) and staying fluent when it comes to architecture (scalability, high availability, securit…

Anyone that has an employer that allows setting learning goals as part of the evaluation process.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#29

Post by scarface74 »

pjmlp wrote: post #28
scarface74 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question is, who has the time? I already have a two to three year agenda to improve up the stack ($cool_kids_front_end framework of the week), down the stack (AWS cloud infrastructure from a developer, infrastructure, devops viewpoint), more breadth at certain levels (get better at Python, big data, ElasticSearch and Kibana) and staying fluent when it comes to architecture (scalability, high availability, securit…

Anyone that has an employer that allows setting learning goals as part of the evaluation process.

I agree and my company does the only two things in support of my learning goals that I could expect. They will let me work on a project using technology that they know I’m not the most experienced with to give me the chance to learn it instead of siloing me on just my area expertise and they reimburse me for AWS certifications. Both of which at the end of the day help them out.

I wouldn’t expect them to let me spend time on the clock to learn Haskell or Rust when we are a C#/JavaScript/Python shop or to learn the ins and outs of Azure since we are an AWS shop.

Re: Ask HN: Should I be learning Scala in 2019?

#30

Post by dikei »

TomVDB wrote: post #22
spir wrote: post #5

This link compares search volume for Scala, Rust, and Kotlin for past 12 months in U.S. https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?geo=US&q=%2Fm%2F091... (Scala wins by a large margin!) Awhile ago I chose Scala for a multi-year side project. I love writing Scala. I think the Scala community is quietly productive and mostly talks to themselves. I'm not a Scala expert by any means, but I have have been programming for aw…

One the things I really don’t like about Scala is yet-another-obscure-build system. I’m forced to use sbt and I don’t like it. And from my reading of my Scala book, the scala compiler is running in some kind of daemon or server instead of a stand-alone compile? I hate it when so much stuff happens in the background and you can’t figure out what it is.

You're not forced to use sbt, it just happened that sbt is the fastest/most reliable way to compile scala code. Maven can compile scala just fine, albeit a little bit slower since it has to spawn a new instance of scala compiler each time.

The scala compiler is stand-alone, all deamon/server implementations are just workaround to speed up build for any build systems other than sbt.

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