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US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

bbc.com

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Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#471

Post by scarmig »

xtian wrote: post #361
javagram wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea, because the feds were supposed to only handle post roads, the military, and free trade between the states and tariffs on international commerce. The modern welfare state, where millions of people are immediately hurt by the federal system grinding to a halt and stopping, would have been anathema to the framers. Nevertheless by popular vote such programs have been federalized and now we have a constitution that d…

> The modern welfare state, where millions of people are immediately hurt by the federal system grinding to a halt and stopping, would have been anathema to the framers. So too would have been the dominance of corporate interests in the political system. But here we are.

So too would women, blacks, Asians, and the poor having the right to vote be anathema to them.

Why again do we really care about parsing exactly what the Founders would say about the modern world?

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#472

Post by ggggtez »

simplecomplex wrote: post #358
save_ferris wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's explicitly illegal for Federal Workers to strike, per the Taft-Hartley Act. On top of that, there's not much indication that this administration really cares about what's popular. Federal workers haven't gotten a paycheck in over a month, suggesting that they should break the law because of the low likelihood of punishment underestimates the lengths to which this administration will go to punish those who oppose…

Break the law? They aren’t slaves. Fuck the law. Nobody is going to jail for quitting their job.

Quitting and striking are different. Sure you could quit, but then when the shutdown ends, you won't have a job at all.

I'm sure some people may consider that option, but others may be hoping to ride it out. Remember, some people want to stay in a federal job due to retirement plans, etc. so they are thinking beyond the short term effects.

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#473

Post by plaidfuji »

Much hand-wringing is being done by well-meaning moderates and centrists here, blaming both the President and Congress, wondering why our system allows for this to happen, expressing solidarity with the furloughed workers. At least the right questions are being asked.

But the fact is that for this to end any time soon, the equivocating masses trying to stay on the sidelines, saying "oh those darned politicians...", are going to have to choose a side. The hardliners on both sides (the people who vote most often) view compromise as unacceptable, so their representatives are going to sit on their hands and vote down bill after bill.

The choice is not between building a wall or not - it is about whether we allow individual actors to use the functioning of the federal government as leverage in political negotiation. It would be the same if Democrats in the House said, "we won't pass a funding bill unless it includes universal healthcare. If you don't agree, you're shutting the government down." Absurd. Continuing government funding with no strings attached is an apolitical opinion, and it's time for centrists to speak up.

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#474

Post by lolc »

bluGill wrote: post #305
mdavidn wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did pass a CR back in December. Everyone thought the President would sign it. He changed his mind.

Still partially their fault for thinking the president would. Even if the president changed his mind afterwards they take some blame as their job is to figure this out in time.

> Even if the president changed his mind afterwards they take some blame as their job is to figure this out in time.

That's the most extravagant line of reasoning I've read in this thread so far. And now my brain is in a knot. I understand you're saying parliament should have proactively made their end of the deal worse because the negotiations were a sham anyway. You realize they're still not willing to do that after negotiations have broken down?

In the end you're just blaming them for not having made a different deal earlier. But that wasn't on the table then, and isn't now. So you're just blaming them for not giving in. Which (disregarding the particulars) is a reasonable position. But somehow you've packed it up all weird.

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#475

Post by praneshp »

samstave wrote: post #279
wonderwonder wrote: post #24

Bearing in mind that ~40% of american's could not come up with $400 to cover emergencies, this is going to become more prevalent in the next few days / weeks as people will simply not be able to afford gas to get to their unpaid work. I read an article today discussing how TSA workers in HI are living in their cars in the airport parking lot as they cannot afford to commute. The FBI just cancelled its internship prog…

Serious questions I have: * Are senators/house reps being paid? If so - Why? * If the government is going to shit on people like this - then why are those people required to pay a tax (which is money extracted from the population to pay for services which the government provides - if the government refuses to provide those services, then why would you be obligated to pay a tax - thus the shutdown should be filed as a…

Senators/house reps being paid has a simple reason I think: The richer ones will simply wait out the poorer ones if pay is suspended.

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#476

Post by rootusrootus »

bluGill wrote: post #174
resters wrote: post #93

At the risk of introducing a political topic into this supposedly apolitical subject, why shouldn't any president simply make demands and then shut down the government until his/her political opponents cave? Seemingly this strategy will not work ever again for either party if proper steps are taken. It seems like a terrible abuse of executive power.

Don't blame only the president, congress has just as much blame for not passing a budget the president would agree to.

The president is responsible for attempting to take the power of the purse from congress, and congress (to be more specific, one party) is responsible for not putting him back in his place. If congress caves, it's going to get worse in the future. The next democratic president may hold the gov't hostage to get some sweet, sweet carbon tax passed. Heck, they'd even have a better claim about it being a national emergency.

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#478

Post by cr1895 »

zentiggr wrote: post #417
metamet wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, to add a bit more context to it, the administration dismissed the issue, saying that people should just work with grocery stores and banks in order to survive. Full text: > Local people know who they are when they go for groceries and everything else. So I think what Wilbur was probably trying to say was that they will work along — I know banks are working along. If you have mortgages, the mortgagees, the folks…

So... mortgage holders are just going to say "oh, you're on furlough... ok, we'll hold your payment schedule and just rewrite the terms once you have pay again." WTF is the disconnect here? Defaults are going to spike and I can't imagine that any significant percentage of them would be forgiven. And I haven't seen a grocery store run 'personal credit' since maybe before the 50s at best? Pre-Depression? Somebody is br…

>And I haven't seen a grocery store run 'personal credit' since maybe before the 50s at best? Pre-Depression?

The ridiculous out-of-touch callousness of it all aside, I remember my parents having credit at a small neighborhood grocery in the 90s-00s. It's not necessarily a relic of the 50s.

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#479

Post by flyingpenguin »

sokoloff wrote: post #271
flyingpenguin wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing that really bothers me about that "They should have savings" logic, is the expectation that they should have to use them. Yes. They should have savings. EVERYONE should have min 3 months of income in savings. No one should be expected to use it.

What's the emergency fund for, if not for loss of income? If there is no condition under which you're expected to use it, it's just stranded money...

Maybe a different emergency happened in early december that tanked their fund?

Re: US shutdown: Flight delays caused by staff shortages

#480

Post by spurcell93 »

busterarm wrote: post #400
hannasanarion wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is 100% the CEO's decision. Remember, he rejected a perfectly good funding plan that was put forward by his own allies back in December, before his enemies took over the board on January 3.

The President makes budget requests to Congress before the budget committees plan and submit their appropriations bills. The perfectly good funding plan did not include the budget requests the President made. Whether you agree with his politics or not is immaterial. It is not 100% his decision.

Right. It's the majority leader's decision to override a veto or keep putting bills on the floor. This is a multi-level catastrophe fabricated by disgusting people.
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