Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids • Hacker News Board

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#41

Post by avar » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:36 PM UTC

MrTonyD wrote: post #27

Hong Kong makes 2 billion a year on public transportation. They did that by giving the land around the station to the transportation agency, so they lease it out long term, and that pays for all the trains and operations. They charge a token fee for using public transportation. I'd prefer to see real public support, rather than a business/profit justification for lower fares, but in the current greed-valued world I'l…

This system is just amounts to indirectly funding public transportation with taxation, just from taxing local properties via rent instead of funding it from general tax revenue.

Perhaps it results in more public support for some reason, I'm unfamiliar with the politics of Hong Kong.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#42

Post by enedil » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:38 PM UTC

Shivetya wrote: post #5

zhoujianfu wrote: post #2

Why not make it just free for everybody? Public transportation typically has profit margins of -50% to -90% anyway... just take it to -100% and get a huge boost in ridership! (And probably save some expenses relating to collecting payment/enforcement.)

previous studies done showed that making it free did not result in significant uptick in usage[1]. It really comes down to, does it go where you want from where you want when you want and all this on a timely basis. Hence the big reason buses always win over rail as they can adapt to changing needs. [1] https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/01/why-can...

Have you been to Europe?

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#43

Post by closeparen » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:39 PM UTC

johannes1234321 wrote: post #29

baq wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

completely free means you have one less legal reason to kick out the bad kind of homeless.

kind of a strawman. Maybe one could also find better ways to give shelter to homeless. And for the bad kid there are other ways than using tickets for that.

Laws are kind of a non sequitor. Maybe one could also find better ways to motivate people to treat each other decently.

But I’m going to continue funding homicide investigations.

“Don’t make things livable in small and practical ways, just hold out for total structural revolution and the solution to multigenerational and intractable social problems” is an infuriating line that unfortunately guides much of San Francisco policymaking.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#44

Post by z0mbie42 » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:41 PM UTC

agumonkey wrote: post #12

Angostura wrote: post #3

Sounds like a good idea. Transport for London already does this.

In France, Lille did make it free for all. This is probably helpful to reduce car needs.

Living part time there, this claim is false.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#45

Post by ahakki » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:43 PM UTC

tom_mellior wrote: post #35

yardie wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike The MTA the Paris metro shuts down at 1AM. So no one is camping out on the platform, for long. And last time I was there the controllers were scanning passes quite frequently.

> So no one is camping out on the platform, for long. I've never been in the Paris métro after it shut down, but are you saying the homeless people camping in some stations in the evenings, wrapped in their sleeping bags, get up at 1 a.m. and file out? I somehow doubt that.

They are kicked out. The doors are locked.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#46

Post by codereflection » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:53 PM UTC

Seattle does this for kids in middle school and high school. Each kid gets an Orca card for free (transit card that we use in the Seattle area). Lots of kids use them, even the kids who travel ~10 miles to get to their school. I know it's saved me a lot of money in gas and bus fare over the years with my kids getting this benefit. The only down side is that the cards are only good for during the school year.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#47

Post by kgwgk » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:55 PM UTC

andys627 wrote: post #20

efrafa wrote: post #19

In Slovakia trains are free for students and seniors. [0] Most people see this very negatively. [0] https://www.slovakrail.sk/en/zero-fare.html

Why is it seen negatively?

Making things free can increase demand beyond what’s reasonable (for example, there was recently someone in the press explaining how, thanks to moviepass, he would enter a cinema just to go to the restroom). Maybe old people take trains just because they can, taking capacity from paying customers that really need the train to get to work or whatever.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#48

Post by tzs » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 10:56 PM UTC

bsaul wrote: post #23

zhoujianfu wrote: post #2

Why not make it just free for everybody? Public transportation typically has profit margins of -50% to -90% anyway... just take it to -100% and get a huge boost in ridership! (And probably save some expenses relating to collecting payment/enforcement.)

Except a boost in ridership is absolutely not what you’d want in an overpopulated city like Paris. Subway is so bad i’ve already witnessed people waiting for trains from outside the station itself. in the peak hours you often have to skip two or three trains because they’re packed.

> in the peak hours you often have to skip two or three trains because they’re packed

What's the interval between trains at peak hours?

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#49

Post by jimktrains2 » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 11:01 PM UTC

tzs wrote: post #48

bsaul wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except a boost in ridership is absolutely not what you’d want in an overpopulated city like Paris. Subway is so bad i’ve already witnessed people waiting for trains from outside the station itself. in the peak hours you often have to skip two or three trains because they’re packed.

> in the peak hours you often have to skip two or three trains because they’re packed What's the interval between trains at peak hours?

A few minutes.

Re: Paris Will Make Public Transportation Free for Kids

#50

Post by niea_11 » Sun, Jan 20, 2019, 11:16 PM UTC

tzs wrote: post #48

bsaul wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except a boost in ridership is absolutely not what you’d want in an overpopulated city like Paris. Subway is so bad i’ve already witnessed people waiting for trains from outside the station itself. in the peak hours you often have to skip two or three trains because they’re packed.

> in the peak hours you often have to skip two or three trains because they’re packed What's the interval between trains at peak hours?

I used to take the metro line 3 from station saint-lazare. At peak hours there was a train practically every minute. As soon as one train leaves another one enters the station a few seconds after. So I often did what parent said. skipping two or three trains isn't that bad when there that many trains.