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Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

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Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#121

Post by skinnymuch »

thrav wrote: post #115
jason_pomerleau wrote: post #16

There is lots of opportunity out there, but it depends on what you mean by ‘small business’. Super small companies (under 10 to 15 people in this context) are usually best off with SquareSpace or Wix. Companies slightly larger than this invariably end up wanting/needing things that these platforms can’t offer, and have the kind of budgets that can support a solo operator or small team. At this level, you are competin…

Out of curiosity, $200k revenue pre-tax? Or $200k take home in your pocket after operating expenses, taxes, health care, etc? My friends who have consulted have pulled in some seemingly hefty sums, only to feel like they came out behind a good salary with good benefits.

But a good salary is pre-tax too unless you’re talking about the actual paycheck which is far lower than listed salary.

There are benefits. Like matching 401K, paid vacation (though if this isn’t long enough it can be a negative), and mainly, health insurance. Those should be counted for a normal salaried job. Otherwise taxes should be compared the same way, no?

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#123

Post by gist »

jason_pomerleau wrote: post #16

There is lots of opportunity out there, but it depends on what you mean by ‘small business’. Super small companies (under 10 to 15 people in this context) are usually best off with SquareSpace or Wix. Companies slightly larger than this invariably end up wanting/needing things that these platforms can’t offer, and have the kind of budgets that can support a solo operator or small team. At this level, you are competin…

I think what you have done (and are doing) is great first off. However a few questions.

1) Why do you use your name for your site ( jasonpomerleau.com ) rather than something easy to remember? For example I run into cases where people are going to need a wordpress site but no way I am going to remember that when I need it.

2) Why does your site have a big picture of you as the homepage image? And I do mean a big picture of you? What is that your unique selling point?

Not intended to be snarky and what you have done is great just curious.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#124

Post by gist »

> Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

> I suddenly felt like I don't have anything to offer that business. I feel so discouraged. I'm a decent programmer

It's not about programming but about design and offering the customer a better product than they can do themselves. Plus you have to have the type of clients (or be able to sell them) on what you can do for them that is better than what they can do themselves. Even if it's just making it simple and not requiring them to think ('don't make me think'). I am sure in the comments here others have said the exact same thing. This is no different than any other sale and marketing. You are one person you aren't trying to fill the pipeline enough for 20 programmers just yourself.

I compete in another area (not web design) which is similar. There are people that do the same exact thing and practically give it away. If I can't get that account either I am not selling or I've got the wrong prospect.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#125

Post by tluyben2 »

It might depend on where you are; here (south EU) it works fine. I know many one person companies making a nice living of making sites for restaurants, real estate agents etc aka very small companies. They have no clue Wix exists but they do not care anyway; they do not want to do it themselves. Even if it is easy, most realize a site is not enough; it is a continues process and they want to spend as little time as they can on it.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#126

Post by yoava »

notahacker wrote: post #43
adamqureshi wrote: post #38

Ad agencies here in NYC sub-contract out work all the time. They are sick of outsourcing to 3rd world. I'd connect with ad agencies in your area see if you can get sub-contract work. And you can charge $1,500-$3k to set up a SquareSpace site. Target dentist, interior designers, yoga studios. Forget the local pizza shop as a customer. If your building with WP then offer support. WP is being updated all the time and wi…

> Forget the local pizza shop as a customer The local pizza shop's potentially a good customer if you're selling them a way to take orders online and get people to buy their special offers and refer their friends through social media . Plenty of value in that, especially if you're yielding more proven results than those flyers they pay to have printed and delivered every couple of months. If you're selling them a hom…

Actually, you can do a lot more with Wix Code, and make a site with all kind of custom functionality, including 'a way to take orders online and get people to buy their special offers and refer their friends through social media'.

But to use Wix Code, you will need to know some level of coding, hence value to sell for your clients.

And I agree, there is a huge market for people to build websites for customers, you need to focus on the value you deliver to your customers, from design all the way to coding, SEO, content and social.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#127

Post by gremlinsinc »

jason_pomerleau wrote: post #16

There is lots of opportunity out there, but it depends on what you mean by ‘small business’. Super small companies (under 10 to 15 people in this context) are usually best off with SquareSpace or Wix. Companies slightly larger than this invariably end up wanting/needing things that these platforms can’t offer, and have the kind of budgets that can support a solo operator or small team. At this level, you are competin…

Whats your hourly?

I'm more laravel/mobile/node/vue/react, and I find I under-charge, but I think if I were doing WP I'd need to charge even less... Currently my best-long-term client pays $40...but I feel I want/deserve 60-70 and trying to land that for my next couple clients... do people pay you more than $40/hr for wordpress or do you just charge per project?

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#128

Post by walshemj »

Those website builders are terrible from a seo perspective WordPress can be moved easily from one hosting provider to another and can be optimised for search.

The sort of client that would be satisfied with wix is not the sort of client you want to deal with.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#129

Post by yoava »

whitehouse3 wrote: post #6
seibelj wrote: post #4

I would assume the money is in the customization. Every business is unique and the cookie cutter website builders get them 80% of the way but there is usually something they really want that needs to be customized. All of the players have plugin systems and raw editors to tweak as needed. The website presence itself is commoditized. The processes that accelerate business usually require customization, even if it’s us…

The other factor is website quality. When all the competition uses a Squarespace or Wix site for their marketing pages, your site can stand out using something like Gatsby JS to be ungodly fast. But this involves writing the whole thing from scratch specific to the customer. I’ve had very good success with this marketing pitch. Customers love to see how their sites are faster and better looking than their dime-a-doze…

You can standout on Wix using Wix Code, which allows you to use your programming skills to code you site, your site backend and a dedicated database for the site.

You will not need to write the whole thing from scratch specific to the customer. Instead, just code the extra bits.

Having said that, I think there is a large market for websites designers and coders, and we see an active community on Wix of people who build websites for customers

Re: Ask HN: Is there any money in website design for small businesses anymore?

#130

Post by goatherders »

gremlinsinc wrote: post #127
jason_pomerleau wrote: post #16

There is lots of opportunity out there, but it depends on what you mean by ‘small business’. Super small companies (under 10 to 15 people in this context) are usually best off with SquareSpace or Wix. Companies slightly larger than this invariably end up wanting/needing things that these platforms can’t offer, and have the kind of budgets that can support a solo operator or small team. At this level, you are competin…

Whats your hourly? I'm more laravel/mobile/node/vue/react, and I find I under-charge, but I think if I were doing WP I'd need to charge even less... Currently my best-long-term client pays $40...but I feel I want/deserve 60-70 and trying to land that for my next couple clients... do people pay you more than $40/hr for wordpress or do you just charge per project?

You are grossly under charging. The first advice I give any dev is to up your rates by 25%. Period. You will not lose any clients. I promise. But $40 an hour for those skills is nuts. In the US WordPress providers typically charge $80 and I tell all of them - ALL - that they should be at at least $100/hour.
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