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Airbnb and security camera disclosure

jeffreybigham.com

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Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#221

Post by URSpider94 »

dhimes wrote: post #215
philip1209 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The trouble is that, if you use any buyer protections available to you outside of the platform, you risk being banned for life. That to me seems unfair. For your case where they wanted evidence - what would have happened if you had no evidence, and ended up issuing a chargeback for "Services not provided? You would have been in the right, but probably would have been banned for life from Airbnb's system. The lack of…

if you use any buyer protections available to you outside of the platform, you risk being banned for life Could you elaborate a bit on this? I've not used airbnb but have a trip coming up and am reading this thread with great interest.

Specifically, if you charge back the stay on your credit card, which would get you a refund. I expect that if you do this, Airbnb will ban you from the platform.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#222

Post by plusbryan »

trophycase wrote: post #156
llampx wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been looking at AirBNBs recently for a vacation. The small guy is an outlier anymore. Most of the listings are obviously professional, ie they do it for a living and have multiple properties and property managers. The network is hard to unravel since the companies behind the "hosts" create many profiles, but it is easy to see that its not just Carla or Emily or Cody offering up their apartment while they go on h…

The last few AirBnBs I've stayed at have all been filled with "stock" goods. The cheapest handsoap, the cheapest paper towels, etc. Basically it looks like they went to the dollar store and filled their house with what's in it, which makes me believe that people don't actually live in there.

Unless AirBNB solicits more fine-grained reviews to elicit feedback on such things, or enacts a policy around consumables, this is the direction many hosts will go. As long as it doesn't reflect in the photos, corners will be cut.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#223

Post by dsfyu404ed »

Retra wrote: post #218
dsfyu404ed wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I submit as evidence a) pretty much every case where a "may issue" permit is required to engage in business (these mostly happen on the state and local level and incentivize corruption). b) Regulatory capture (e.g. the current FCC). c) The war on drugs (I can come up with other examples of unnecessarily criminalizing things if needed). And on the other side, the movies/music/video games/tv rating system sure isn't pe…

"Regulating whenever something bad happens" is problematic, but it's a bit of a straw man. You should be regulating wherever people are incentivized to do bad things, which happens quite often when you don't offer any oversight whatsoever. Especially when you are unwilling to even regulate the reporting of misbehavior.

>but it's a bit of a straw man.

Knee jerk legislation is not a straw man. It happens all the time. The CFAA is a knee-jerk law. Here[1] is a more recent example.

[1]https://abcnews.go.com/US/ny-gov-andrew-cuomo-bans-stretch-l...

And the last paragraph of the article mentions banning long vehicles, which itself is a knee jerk response to when a drunk t-boned a limo on Long Island awhile back.

I agree about regulating incentives though.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#224

Post by arthurofbabylon »

Many of the complaints of mistreatment illustrate a feature of this housing marketplace: big capital assets are in control, not the demand.

This runs counter to many other marketplaces millennials (+- 10 years) are used to. Shoes? Chocolate? Restaurants? Types of alcohol? Transportation? Whatever the customer wants, the customer gets.

It’s a simple reality that Airbnb will align with the host who brings in $10-30k/yr over even the frequent traveler who spends $1-10k.

I’m super interested in understanding how this might bite Airbnb or open opportunities for competitors. I’m very curious about these huge economic, behavioral shifts and what they mean for the quality of a product/service and how these services align with humanity’s best interests.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#225

Post by philip1209 »

alexhutcheson wrote: post #211
philip1209 wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a short-term tenant who isn't eligible for property insurance, there is no way for me insure against losses. I spent considerable time trying to get a policy after our burglary, and it wasn't possible. In my opinion, providing this insurance should be handled by the marketplace. The problem is that Airbnb stays are similar to airline flight delays - the cost of a problem can result in many times more costs than ju…

Depending on your policy, your homeowners insurance or renters insurance (at your long-term home) may cover you for theft from hotels, Airbnbs, etc. If yours doesn't, you could shop around for one that does.

As a digital nomad, I have no long-term home. I literally live in Airbnbs. I tried finding a policy to cover me, but none exists. Policies also vary a lot with burglaries - eg some require signs of forced entry.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#226

Post by John_KZ »

I recently tried to book over AirBnB just for the convenience of it. They requested government id and a new photo of me for verification. They also (indirectly and insidiously) asked for my permissions so sell all my personal data listed in the ID (biometrics, height, skin colour, ID number etc). Of course you'd have to read the privacy policy to know this, and many people don't. Also their facebook login asked for a list of all my friends as well as all my likes. What the hell does that have anything to do with them?

I just booked off their platform. It was easier and cheaper, and definitely more private. I also wouldn't recommend anyone to get vendor-locked so hard as to have their livelihood depended on this company's policies.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#227

Post by whitepoplar »

philip1209 wrote: post #120

I've lived in Airbnbs full-time for about 18 months while traveling, and Airbnb has lost my trust repeatedly in terms of reliability, safety, and user-friendliness. - Host listing quality has gone consistently downhill. Now, it's many slumlords just trying to make a quick buck rather than support the original community idea or provide a great stay. - Airbnb support response times are horribly slow. They hide their ph…

I've had similar Airbnb experiences as you, and I'm convinced that Airbnb has the worst customer service of any company I've ever dealt with. I've never felt more defeated, humiliated, and powerless as I've felt when dealing with them. I used to think, "those people who have problems are just exaggerating, or they're problem customers." Nope, Airbnb will screw over everyone, and make them gag on cloying "community" marketing in the process.

I like the idea of Airbnb and many of the apartments can be great, but boy do I wish Airbnb would die a cold, harsh death.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#228

Post by plusbryan »

izacus wrote: post #86

The fact that AirBnB even allows recording inside of the rented appartments is utterly mind-boggling to me. I always assumed they'd ban recording or guests outright. Your home (even a temporarily rented one) is pretty much the primary place where you should expect complete privacy at all times.

Agreed. Even if I choose to have recording devices in my home, and then rent out on a temporary basis, it would be trivial for me to take them down before renting it out. Plus, I have the financial incentive to do so.

Allowing hosts to have cameras inside the rented space, regardless of recording state, seems like a bad policy indeed.

The only "legitimate" reason a host would want active cameras in the home is for protection against bad guests. This belies AirBnB's supposed "host guarantee" which should prevent this concern in the first place.

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#229

Post by traek »

munchbunny wrote: post #205
michaelchisari wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if the Airbnb team has ever thought about their profit and its relationship to the externalities you describe I'm convinced the majority of "unicorns" ignore (or actively dodge) externalities in favor of lucrative profits.

I'm convinced the majority of "unicorns" ignore (or actively dodge) externalities in favor of lucrative profits. I think most companies develop convenient ethical blind spots where profit motive conflicts with the ethical problem from generating externalities. AirBnB takes a strong moral stand on "inclusion" as a principle but has a clear blind spot when it comes to consumer, property, and residential externalities.…

> Facebook takes a strong moral stand on free speech, but it has a clear blind spot for privacy and public discourse.

I think Facebook expressly does not take a stand for free speech, they've been pretty clear about banning offensive/hateful/sexual content from their platform (to the point of being prudish, e.g. with female nipples).

Re: Airbnb and security camera disclosure

#230

Post by ryandrake »

URSpider94 wrote: post #221
dhimes wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you use any buyer protections available to you outside of the platform, you risk being banned for life Could you elaborate a bit on this? I've not used airbnb but have a trip coming up and am reading this thread with great interest.

Specifically, if you charge back the stay on your credit card, which would get you a refund. I expect that if you do this, Airbnb will ban you from the platform.

Which is fine though, right?

If I’m at the point in a dispute with a company where I’m invoking a credit card chargeback, I’m NEVER wanting to do business with them again, for any reason. I’ve always assumed chargeback == bridge burned.

Why would you continue doing business with a company behaving badly?

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