Feds Can't Force You to Unlock Your iPhone with Finger or Face, Judge Rules

Post by Retra » Mon, Jan 14, 2019, 9:13 PM UTC

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #18

Retra wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that the police use polygraphs simply as a 'primed' question-asking session for people who agree to take them. It is no different from sitting down and asking someone questions, except maybe they will believe you can tell that they are lying, and so might be more honest. The polygraph doesn't have to be evidence because your answers to questions are evidence by themselves. Whether you are hooked u…

> Whether you are hooked up to a polygraph is irrelevant. I'm going to go with strongly disagree here.

Post by dreamcompiler » Mon, Jan 14, 2019, 9:17 PM UTC

briandear wrote: post #24

laurentl wrote: post #19

Any idea if and how this ruling (if upheld) can be used to refuse phone seizures / password requests by CBP when entering the country? The ruling relies on the 5th amendment so its scope is limited to American citizens I guess. And whatever the rule of law it’s probably not a good idea to piss off a CBP agent... but still, it’d be nice to be able to travel to the US without having to wipe one’s phone and social media…

There is a Border Search Exception to the 4th Amendment established by the courts; this ruling has no relevance at at port of entry.

Post by jedberg » Mon, Jan 14, 2019, 9:19 PM UTC

nerflad wrote: post #29

This might be a good time to let others know: Android (at least my OnePlus) has a "Lockdown" mode in the shutdown menu that locks the screen and prevents the usage of the biometric methods. You have to use the password. This is good because passwords have already been hashed out in court and are unequivocally protected by the fifth amendment; you don't have to tell an officer your password (and entering it for them c…

Post by bootlooped » Mon, Jan 14, 2019, 9:20 PM UTC

jakelazaroff wrote: post #3

Relevant excerpt: > “The undersigned finds that a biometric feature is analogous to the 20 nonverbal, physiological responses elicited during a polygraph test, which are used to determine guilt or innocence, and are considered testimonial.” So it's analogous to a passcode because you're divulging something stored by your body, as opposed to e.g. a metal key which is artificial. Tangentially related, it's astounding t…

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jan 14, 2019, 9:22 PM UTC

chooseaname wrote: post #23

derekp7 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought that polygraphs were not accepted as evidence in court, but are still used by some government and private agencies. Also, just curious, have they been discredited as in that double-blind trials show no more than a 50/50 chance of being correct (i.e., flipping a coin)? Or is it that a high enough percentage of people will fail them even if innocent, or pass them even if guilty? The thing I don't like about t…

> I thought that polygraphs were not accepted as evidence in court... Only if you "pass". Fail one and admissible or not, it'll be brought up.