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So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

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Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#491

Post by rubatuga »

saagarjha wrote: post #295
Tehchops wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Almost all my colleagues struggled with setting up python 2 und 3 correctly at some point, whereas this just worked for me on Linux. This is one area where I'd have to concede the Apple experience is objectively suboptimal. However, the Python ecosystem isn't doing anyone any favors here.

> However, the Python ecosystem isn't doing anyone any favors here. Apple isn't, either. They ship a version of Python by default that is woefully out of date and conflicts with any other Python that you install, and what's more, some of their tools (notably, LLDB) freak out if you have a newer Python on your $PATH.

Except you forgot Apple ships Python 2.7.15, which was released in 2018. It's actually quite up to date.

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#492

Post by roadbeats »

chrisseaton wrote: post #159
roadbeats wrote: post #21

I guess the author actually meant to say “So long, OSX” as Macbooks (older than 2016 versions) actually are good hosts for running Linux. I myself run have two Macbooks (Air 13 and Pro 15) with dual boot setup, so I get the best of two worlds: perfect programming setup (i3) on Linux, perfect multimedia (I use Lightroom / Premiere sometimes) setup on OSX.

> I guess the author actually meant to say “So long, OSX” It's called macOS, if you're going to be pedantic about something someone else wrote. It's not been called OSX (actually OS X) for years.

I didn't mean to be pedantic. Any name that refers to the software is fine.

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#493

Post by naibafo »

zrobotics wrote: post #161
naibafo wrote: post #85

There are different issues with OSX though, that colleagues of mine had, that never occur with Linux. E.g. the chore of somehow managing different software versions such as the outdated default one and a second one installed with homebrew. Almost all my colleagues struggled with setting up python 2 und 3 correctly at some point, whereas this just worked for me on Linux. Some struggled with font rendering between a 10…

To be fair, that may be a python problem, as I've also had issues with 2 & 3 on a Linux machine as well. At this point, unless I can avoid it I just use a VM for any python 2 work.

I didn't mean just managing 2 and 3.

OSX comes with some software such as git and python2 preinstalled. However they do not usually keep that software up to date and there is no way for you to change that, which means that community package managers need to be used to install more up to date software versions in parallel to the system ones

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#494

Post by neuronic »

davidy123 wrote: post #294
Tehchops wrote: post #42

End-user Linux has definitely improved in the last few years. It offers a lot of attractive features for what I imagine to be the typical HN demographic. That being said, it's still got rough spots that OSX doesn't. It works great when it works, but when it doesn't.... Font rendering, display/compositor fragmentation etc... Inb4 the anecdotal "well it works for me I just had to download the xf86 font library and comp…

Maybe I'm missing something, but font rendering seems fine on Ubuntu without any after install steps. I've been using Ubuntu exclusively for well over a decade for everyday work, only occasionally going into a Windows VM, and it's really been perfectly fine, great even, as a developer. I bought a X1 Yoga the month after it was released and Ubuntu installed perfectly on it, the only thing that didn't work out of the b…

> and it's really been perfectly fine, great even, as a developer

Here is the point. It absolutely is fine as a developer. But my parents would never be able to get accustomed to Ubuntu or any other distro. It was hard enough to make them use email.

The truth is that the vast majority of people just want things to work. Like turning on a TV without any setup. Hell, people pay electronics stores 100€ to plugin a cable and run the "find channels" function.

OECD studies have shown that more people than one thinks are incapable of using search in email [1].

[1] https://www.nngroup.com/articles/computer-skill-levels/

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#495

Post by naibafo »

csomar wrote: post #301
naibafo wrote: post #85

There are different issues with OSX though, that colleagues of mine had, that never occur with Linux. E.g. the chore of somehow managing different software versions such as the outdated default one and a second one installed with homebrew. Almost all my colleagues struggled with setting up python 2 und 3 correctly at some point, whereas this just worked for me on Linux. Some struggled with font rendering between a 10…

I might be unlucky but Linux had been a nightmare on the few laptops I've tried it on. It is not that I have not tried. I did. Some of the problems I had: Very slow UI, not recognizing my Wifi Card, Chrome stopping support for CentOS, Problems with the Graphic Card and multiple monitors, problems with most printers I try, problem with my Bluetooth mouse... Linux and the multiple variants have been horrible. Also, you…

It sounds like you were really unlucky. The last time I struggled with any of the issues mentioned by you is at least 4 or 5 years in the past.

> But you are ignoring the fact that installing software on Linux is still a mess of resolving all the dependencies and the package manager. Where in OS X, it is just a file move to App.

This is also highly dependent on specific experiences. I haven't had any issues with conflicting dependencies on Arch linux in the past few years. And personally I appreciate a system package manager for all software instead of having to download applications and doing drag and drop for installation

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#496

Post by naibafo »

rubatuga wrote: post #491
saagarjha wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> However, the Python ecosystem isn't doing anyone any favors here. Apple isn't, either. They ship a version of Python by default that is woefully out of date and conflicts with any other Python that you install, and what's more, some of their tools (notably, LLDB) freak out if you have a newer Python on your $PATH.

Except you forgot Apple ships Python 2.7.15, which was released in 2018. It's actually quite up to date.

maybe it is right now. But in my experience they usually don't keep them up to date very well

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#497

Post by rikkus »

polyfather wrote: post #322
geoka9 wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started using X1 Carbon 6th recently and it's an amazing little machine. Extremely portable (a 14" that weighs 2.5 lbs and fits in a 13" sleeve), great keyboard, great Linux support, good display, and it runs very cool (the fan is never on, despite running multiple virtualbox instances in addition to regular work that causes sporadic CPU spikes - e.g. compiling). It's also very pleasant to touch and hold in your ha…

I have to agree. I was never a big fan of laptops before, but I've really come to enjoy my 6th gen X1. The keyboard is surprisingly nice (for a laptop) and the battery lasts long enough to not annoy me when I'm on the move. The fingerprint reader doesn't work though, not that I know what I would use one for.

I installed KDE Neon on a t450s recently and the fingerprint reader was the only hardware that didn’t work out of the box. I had to install an extra package and add some lines to a pam config file.

I use it to log in, plus to auth for anything that requires root. I’m doing some coding so occasionally do something that requires sudo in a terminal. A prompt appears and asks me to swipe my finger. It’s very neat.

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#498

Post by rikkus »

geggam wrote: post #53
AdmiralAsshat wrote: post #23

I find the fetish for terminal-based music players a bit odd. I associate terminals with doing work , so the idea of having one whose sole purpose is playing music (presumably in the background while you do other stuff) to feel like a waste of screen real-estate and something I'm likely to accidentally pull up while trying to cycle between my other terminal windows where I'm doing stuff. I much prefer something that…

You just need a bigger monitor. I hooked a 4k 42 inch LCD to my laptop and for the first time ever I had visible desktop space

This works really well if you have excellent eyesight or if the screen is curved but so have to physically move sideways to see different windows with this size screen. It’s a good problem to have, of course!

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#499

Post by tpush »

rubatuga wrote: post #491
saagarjha wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> However, the Python ecosystem isn't doing anyone any favors here. Apple isn't, either. They ship a version of Python by default that is woefully out of date and conflicts with any other Python that you install, and what's more, some of their tools (notably, LLDB) freak out if you have a newer Python on your $PATH.

Except you forgot Apple ships Python 2.7.15, which was released in 2018. It's actually quite up to date.

My Mac on Mojave ships with Python 2.7.10 which was released May 23, 2015.

Re: So Long, Macbook. Hello Again, Linux

#500

Post by flurdy »

vesak wrote: post #71

Man, this is so weird. I used Linux from 1996ish to 2017 and then just moved almost everything to Apple. I don’t remember the exact reason, but probably it had something to do with Wayland taking forever to stabilize, and the community starting to smell bad. And I’m happy, probably happier than before. Sure, Apple’s stuff isn’t perfect, but it’s way closer to it than any Linux combination I ever tried. The only thing…

To replace i3/xMonad on macOS try Amethyst which does tiling pretty well https://github.com/ianyh/Amethyst
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