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Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

bbc.com

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Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#41

Post by Steer »

tbassetto wrote: post #22
TomMarius wrote: post #2

"Some protesters feel speed cameras are solely a revenue-generating measure which takes money from the poor." This is also the case in Central and Eastern Europe. EDIT: Please read what I cited properly. The citation includes the "Some protesters feel ..." part, which is what I meant - that many people in central and eastern Europe feel the same, not that I feel they're right (what I think is irrelevant).

Meanwhile, most of Scandinavia determines speeding fines based on income.

Finland does. Sweden and Denmark do not. Norway I don't know, but suspect not.

Source: I live in Sweden and recently got caught by a speed camera in Denmark.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#42

Post by c1sc0 »

eastendguy wrote: post #14

Why the hate for speed cameras? I love speed cameras because they make the roads safer for everyone. (And yes, once in a while I get a ticket as well, which is always a good reminder to drive safely.)

Because many see it as a tax. Especially when safely matching the actual speed of traffic will consistently get you the lowest ticket of about 50 EUR for being 5km above the limit.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#43

Post by rikkus »

chrisper wrote: post #35
eastendguy wrote: post #14

Why the hate for speed cameras? I love speed cameras because they make the roads safer for everyone. (And yes, once in a while I get a ticket as well, which is always a good reminder to drive safely.)

They would make the roads safer if they weren't used so often as money machines. Do they stand at schools? Nope. They stand at the bottom of the hill at the exit of a town.

They used to be positioned like this in the UK but all the ones I’ve seen like this have been removed or moved over the years to places where they could be regarded as more for safety than easy money making.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#45

Post by Maakuth »

TomMarius wrote: post #2

"Some protesters feel speed cameras are solely a revenue-generating measure which takes money from the poor." This is also the case in Central and Eastern Europe. EDIT: Please read what I cited properly. The citation includes the "Some protesters feel ..." part, which is what I meant - that many people in central and eastern Europe feel the same, not that I feel they're right (what I think is irrelevant).

Interestingly here in my native Finland, traffic tickets for major violations are progressive. So for a low income driver, major speeding might lose your license for months, but only cost you 150 €. The same infraction would cost a upper-middle income individual 15 000 €. Apparently the biggest speeding ticket written in here has been 170 000 €.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#46

Post by adrianN »

dijit wrote: post #38
eastendguy wrote: post #14

Why the hate for speed cameras? I love speed cameras because they make the roads safer for everyone. (And yes, once in a while I get a ticket as well, which is always a good reminder to drive safely.)

Technically not true. There are accidents caused by those who slow unexpectedly because they only just realised there's a speed-trap. It adds an element of unpredictability to the road. This almost completely offsets any positive safety gain. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3861844/ Which makes me think it's a cash-grab.

The solution seems to be to put of more of them so people constantly expect their presence. More modern designs are also capable of calculating average speeds over longer stretches of the road.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#47

Post by toolslive »

eastendguy wrote: post #14

Why the hate for speed cameras? I love speed cameras because they make the roads safer for everyone. (And yes, once in a while I get a ticket as well, which is always a good reminder to drive safely.)

Some of these cameras are hidden: positioned so that you cannot spot them from afar (and not advertised by a sign neither). If the sole purpose would be to help people to drive safely then you should advertise them, make them really visible aso.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#48

Post by gambiting »

naz wrote: post #32
gambiting wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's where the penalty points come in - you can't pay your way out of losing your licence once you get enough of them. The fine might be meaningless but having to stop driving for 12 months is not.

Penalty points also disproportionately affect the poor, who are more likely to depend on their driving license for their income

So what do you propose? That we punish people who put others in danger less because they are poor? Someone moving at 100km/h through a city isn't any less likely to kill someone when hit just because they are poor. They aren't any less of a danger just because they have a family that depends on them. Someone they hit won't be any less dead because the driver has 5 children and mountains of debt.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#49

Post by adrianN »

arkh wrote: post #39
Bayart wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're not located at areas where lower speeds would improve safety, they're located at areas where they make the most money. At least that's how people feel. I'm personally generally dubious on speed limit based policies.

The Montpellier area : 2x3 ways limited to 110km/h + 2x3 ways limited to 90 km/h. Road in perfect state. So let's put an average speed radar system.

Sometimes speed limits are there to reduce noise.

Re: Yellow vests knock out 60% of all speed cameras in France

#50

Post by Hoasi »

Welcome to civil non-compliance 2.0: vandalism as a form of protest. So now taxes perceived as unjust warrant the destruction of state property in retaliation. The French government has already stepped back before. But it never seems enough for protesters.

It does look like a much bigger movement than the state had anticipated. If enough people stop paying taxes this will get serious.

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