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Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

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Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#61

Post by baddox »

mikestew wrote: post #23
baddox wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many years ago I had to clock in and out of a job with a fingerprint scanner. I had the same issue because I played acoustic guitar a lot and had thick calluses on my fingers that would occasionally crack.

Mandolin positions your finger such that the callouses form even further onto the fingerprint than with guitar. I gave up on TouchID with my left hand (thumb still worked, though), and FaceID was a nice upgrade.

Yeah, I believe at one point I had them rescan with my left thumbprint.

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#62

Post by joncrane »

darkpuma wrote: post #60
claudiawerner wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the technology were fetishised, the tech itself would acquire the status of fetish, which isn't the same as the tech being used to ends of fulfilling a fetish (e.g voyeurism). Some brands arguably promote technology fetishism, but fetishism isn't necessarily sexual, for instance the theory of commodity fetishism.

Just to be clear, I'm talking about weird dudes with prurient motivations scanning unconsenting people through the walls of their homes.

I think in this case you want to replace "fetishize" with "pervert." The verb, not the noun, but the word fits.

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#63

Post by trumped »

Retric wrote: post #55
Digit-Al wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, I think (though I could be wrong) that when they talk about privacy concerns they mean the sort of concerns the average person would have about having a camera about... I.e. naked or compromising pictures of themselves getting leaked. I would guess this wouldn't be a problem with radar as it doesn't create images. Out of curiosity though, not having much knowledge on the subject myself, what would be your se…

Radar can create images just not true to life color photos. But, leak such a photo of a couple in their bedroom with the blinds closed and you have a problem.

I can see through my blinds with a regular Nikon 300mm zoom lens .... I think because there is enough light going through the bunch of holes?

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#64

Post by NorthOf33rd »

Digit-Al wrote: post #44
andrewstellman wrote: post #35

> And unlike with object recognition that uses cameras, there are no privacy concerns, or need to maintain line-of-sight or good lighting conditions. Radar works through different materials and in the dark as well as the light. Wait, what? The ability to see through walls and not require line of sight leads to fewer privacy concerns? Seems to me the privacy concerns are significantly greater for radar than facial rec…

Firstly, I think (though I could be wrong) that when they talk about privacy concerns they mean the sort of concerns the average person would have about having a camera about... I.e. naked or compromising pictures of themselves getting leaked. I would guess this wouldn't be a problem with radar as it doesn't create images. Out of curiosity though, not having much knowledge on the subject myself, what would be your se…

Don’t confuse privacy with secrecy. I know what you do in the bathroom, but you still close the door. That’s because you want privacy, not secrecy. (From I have nothing to hide. Why should I care about my privacy? : https://medium.com/@FabioAEsteves/i-have-nothing-to-hide-why...)

From a previous HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14394863

google has no business needing to know where I am or am not. (even though they already do, thanks android/google-fi/chrome-cast/nest/etc etc.)

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#65

Post by sh1mmer »

andrewstellman wrote: post #35

> And unlike with object recognition that uses cameras, there are no privacy concerns, or need to maintain line-of-sight or good lighting conditions. Radar works through different materials and in the dark as well as the light. Wait, what? The ability to see through walls and not require line of sight leads to fewer privacy concerns? Seems to me the privacy concerns are significantly greater for radar than facial rec…

The video linked below literally has an example of this technology recognizing individual credit card even when stacked. While (I assume) the CVV code isn't readable because it's not embossed into the card this still seems like exactly the kind of application that does have privacy implications.

Imagine someone sticking these under the chair in a cafe and skimming the card numbers of everyone who sits down.

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#66

Post by Evidlo »

crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #47
Digit-Al wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, I think (though I could be wrong) that when they talk about privacy concerns they mean the sort of concerns the average person would have about having a camera about... I.e. naked or compromising pictures of themselves getting leaked. I would guess this wouldn't be a problem with radar as it doesn't create images. Out of curiosity though, not having much knowledge on the subject myself, what would be your se…

Emotional manipulation. Using radar to detect emotional states with 70% accuracy for the general public was achieved 2 years ago by the EQ Radio team at MIT. They did this by detecting breathing & heart rate at a level of accuracy on par with wired sensors. This tech works through walls for multiple people at a time, whether they're sitting still or moving. The world is not emotionally responsible enough to protect a…

Pretty sure their heartbeat and breathing detection was for still bodies only.

I sat through one of their presentations. Definitely cool, but I think a bit overhyped.

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#67

Post by ethbro »

darkpuma wrote: post #60
claudiawerner wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the technology were fetishised, the tech itself would acquire the status of fetish, which isn't the same as the tech being used to ends of fulfilling a fetish (e.g voyeurism). Some brands arguably promote technology fetishism, but fetishism isn't necessarily sexual, for instance the theory of commodity fetishism.

Just to be clear, I'm talking about weird dudes with prurient motivations scanning unconsenting people through the walls of their homes.

To expound, why people are taking issue with word choice:

fet·ish·ize - verb - Make (something) the object of a sexual fetish.

Ergo, fetishizing the technology prolly isn't what you meant.

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#68

Post by mc32 »

ethbro wrote: post #67
darkpuma wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just to be clear, I'm talking about weird dudes with prurient motivations scanning unconsenting people through the walls of their homes.

To expound, why people are taking issue with word choice: fet·ish·ize - verb - Make (something) the object of a sexual fetish. Ergo, fetishizing the technology prolly isn't what you meant.

I think it's pretty clear that they meant using the technology to fulfil a (sexual) fetish.

Granted, it's not ordinary usage, but in context, I think the meaning was decipherable.

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#69

Post by crawfordcomeaux »

Evidlo wrote: post #66
crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emotional manipulation. Using radar to detect emotional states with 70% accuracy for the general public was achieved 2 years ago by the EQ Radio team at MIT. They did this by detecting breathing & heart rate at a level of accuracy on par with wired sensors. This tech works through walls for multiple people at a time, whether they're sitting still or moving. The world is not emotionally responsible enough to protect a…

Pretty sure their heartbeat and breathing detection was for still bodies only. I sat through one of their presentations. Definitely cool, but I think a bit overhyped.

So we may have some time to prepare ourselves culturally before the tech is production ready.

Re: Google’s Project Soli radar is sensitive enough to count sheets of paper

#70

Post by rrauenza »

NorthOf33rd wrote: post #64
Digit-Al wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, I think (though I could be wrong) that when they talk about privacy concerns they mean the sort of concerns the average person would have about having a camera about... I.e. naked or compromising pictures of themselves getting leaked. I would guess this wouldn't be a problem with radar as it doesn't create images. Out of curiosity though, not having much knowledge on the subject myself, what would be your se…

Don’t confuse privacy with secrecy. I know what you do in the bathroom, but you still close the door. That’s because you want privacy, not secrecy. (From I have nothing to hide. Why should I care about my privacy? : https://medium.com/@FabioAEsteves/i-have-nothing-to-hide-why... ) From a previous HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14394863 google has no business needing to know where I am or am not.…

Your Medium link didn't work -- here it is after a google search:

https://medium.com/@FabioAEsteves/i-have-nothing-to-hide-why...

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