Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S • Hacker News Board

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#111

Post by imnotlost » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

assblaster wrote: post #65

uncoder0 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We really need to address the absolute cost of healthcare in this country before we can make any progress on nationalizing any portion of it. The pure costs are outrageous. We spend ~$10,000 per capita in 2017 vs ~$6,000 in Norway which has a similar per capita GDP. (PPP adjusted https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/health-... )

Actually that's not that bad for the United States since the obesity rate in the US is 4x that of Norway. If the US got its obesity rate under control, we could save a lot of money (less hypertension, less diabetes).

The US health care system is a very well run billing machine with average (compared to other developed nations) health outcomes as a lucky side-effect.

I pay $6000+/year in health insurance in the US + deductibles + co-pays + + + and I don't even know if they'll cover me when shit really hits the fan - but hey, I'll get a flu shot "for free".

Check profit margins for companies in the health care space, they're pretty good.

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#112

Post by wil421 » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

tlb wrote: post #90

wil421 wrote: post #29

>These results are based on telephone interviews with approximately 1,000 adults per year, aged 15 and older, conducted in the U.S. They only asked 1,000 adults via phone calls? Pretty small survey but I’m not a statistician. Edit: Downvoters. Please comment. Was the survey larger? Is 1,000 a large enough sample size to make conclusions about the whole US? This is HN please engage.

1000 gets you down to 3% margin of sampling error. Asking the question in different ways can affect the results a lot more.

Not very knowledgeable of margin of errors but does 1,000 people, not women, really give you enough data to represent 30+ million females between 15-30?

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#113

Post by whatshisface » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

bborud wrote: post #35

whatshisface wrote: post #15

I see that people are assuming that the ones who want to leave do so because they feel the government is insufficiently liberal. The truth is, I have met some people who wish they could leave to go somewhere more conservative. I think that everyone would want to leave the US if somewhere out there was a utopia that exactly implemented their political and social views. The main thing that tamps down that desire is the…

Anecdotal evidence isn't really all that interesting.

Anecdotal evidence is interesting because it prompts you to consider the mechanism by which that one case might arise, and it also proves that such a thing is possible. It's basically a statement with the logical qualifier "There exists...".

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#114

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

skh wrote: post #16

Ultimately this indicates that people aren’t satisfied with the returns on taxation. I’m all for supporting a government that supports the people. From my perspective we don’t have this and haven’t had it for some time. Other developed nations have better infrastructure, better social support system, near free higher education, free at point of contact healthcare systems. What we get in the U.S. is the most advanced…

[deleted]

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#115

Post by tcoff91 » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

arbol wrote: post #104

tristor wrote: post #57

I find it interesting how many comments here and on other sites that linked the same article talk about this being tied to concerns around how their tax dollars are spent. It seems many people are not aware that the US is one of only two countries which taxes it's citizens no matter where they reside. Leaving the US is not enough if you wish to avoid taxation, you must also acquire citizenship in another country, and…

How can the US tax foreign income? Presumably they would have no idea about your earnings abroad.

It’s up to you to report it and it’s a crime not to.

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#116

Post by cazum » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

andrewmcwatters wrote: post #50

Age 15-29: 30% I don't really give a shit about 15 year olds and their perspective on the world considering they hardly live in it until about 10 years later. The biggest impacts on their lives are from their parents' circumstance or decision making.

People don't suddenly become politically aware at 18. Paying taxes and graduating high school doesn't grant you deep political insight.

>The biggest impacts on their lives are from their parents' circumstance or decision making. While yes, their parents generally have the greatest direct control over their material conditions, the assumption that they then can't have any insights into political conditions that surround their parents, and their own, lives is absurd. For example, the gun violence high school walkouts were conducted by plenty of fifteen year olds, whose lives are directly affected by political conditions.

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#117

Post by CydeWeys » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:22 PM UTC

PakG1 wrote: post #89

tristor wrote: post #57

I find it interesting how many comments here and on other sites that linked the same article talk about this being tied to concerns around how their tax dollars are spent. It seems many people are not aware that the US is one of only two countries which taxes it's citizens no matter where they reside. Leaving the US is not enough if you wish to avoid taxation, you must also acquire citizenship in another country, and…

Americans can't declare themselves as non-residents that don't need to pay tax? Canadians who work abroad can do that. And then if they ever move back home, they just have to declare residency again. It's a bit of a process to do both, of course, but it's definitely there. Without this, Canadians who work abroad also get taxed on their global income. Just if you're lucky to work in a country with which Canada has a t…

American citizens pay US taxes, full stop. As the comment you're replying to says, this is very unusual among countries. Canada doesn't work the same way.

Although you don't get double-taxed, so if you're living anywhere where the tax rate is higher than in the US you pay nothing to the US. If you're living in a tax haven like the Bahamas then you do pay a substantial amount.

Even when you're not paying you have to continue filing US tax forms, though, which is annoying and complicated in international tax situations.

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#118

Post by pseudolus » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:23 PM UTC

PakG1 wrote: post #89

tristor wrote: post #57

I find it interesting how many comments here and on other sites that linked the same article talk about this being tied to concerns around how their tax dollars are spent. It seems many people are not aware that the US is one of only two countries which taxes it's citizens no matter where they reside. Leaving the US is not enough if you wish to avoid taxation, you must also acquire citizenship in another country, and…

Americans can't declare themselves as non-residents that don't need to pay tax? Canadians who work abroad can do that. And then if they ever move back home, they just have to declare residency again. It's a bit of a process to do both, of course, but it's definitely there. Without this, Canadians who work abroad also get taxed on their global income. Just if you're lucky to work in a country with which Canada has a t…

The US has tax treaties with pretty much every country that's a viable destination. [0] Double taxation is not really much of an issue. What is an issue, however, is that there still exists the requirement to file an annual return which can be a pretty expensive proposition over the years, especially if a person is retaining an accountant to handle things (as they should given the complexities of US non-resident citizen returns).

[0]: https://www.irs.gov/businesses/international-businesses/unit...

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#119

Post by kortilla » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:23 PM UTC

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #71

the_watcher wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To most people, Social Security is seen as a tax, since it comes out of your paycheck in the form of a "Social Security Tax".

It's also an unusually regressive tax, because it's flat rate, which isn't that bad if what it funds is progressively delivered (i.e. paid out the same to everyone rather than based on how much income you had), but it isn't. And then on top of that there is an income cap above which you don't pay any more.

It’s paid out based on how much you contributed. Flat rate doesn’t mean everyone pays the same thing, it means same percentage.

Re: Record Numbers of Americans Want to Leave the U.S

#120

Post by tdb7893 » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:23 PM UTC

ausbah wrote: post #13

% of people who will actually leave the US? I'd wager near 0.

Partially it's just really hard to move, visas can be hard to come by and moving away from family is difficult. For what it's worth though my parents currently live in Amsterdam (and love it) and my in laws moved to Canada. My cousin moved to New Zealand, my uncle to Rome, and my wife is trying to convince me to go to England. It's obviously an outlier case but about 1/4 of my family has left and they all seem to prefer being out.