$1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit • Hacker News Board

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#91

Post by 24gttghh » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:09 PM UTC

GreaterFool wrote: post #10

> have shifted at least £800 billion ($1 trillion) worth of assets out of the country And what's the significance of that? Suppose I had $100 in a bank in UK and I moved it to a bank in Germany. Neither country is better or worse because of that. The article doesn't bother to explain the ramifications. Deals are made in UK because English law is really, really good. Having to maintain offices in EU will surely increa…

>Neither country is better or worse because of that. The article doesn't bother to explain the ramifications.

This is not entirely true [0]. The money-multiplier effect would mean the bank in Germany then has something like ~$900 more dollars (converted to Euro's of course) that it could loan out. I'm not sure on their exact Reserve Requirement, but it appears to be less than 10%. Apparently the UK doesn't have much of a Reserve Requirement though, so perhaps they would not necessarily lose out as much as Germany would gain in this scenario.

[0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional-reserve_banking#Mon...

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#92

Post by growlist » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:10 PM UTC

NicoJuicy wrote: post #76

growlist wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And property prices in London/South East become affordable again, Sterling falls benefiting inward investment, exports, and tourism. So not all bad news then! :) There's so much defeatism within the UK and anti-Brexit propaganda flying around from vested interests. It's all so tiresome. > Brexit is a self inflicted shot to the head. Money isn't the only thing in life.

I'll add another quote, only the sun shines for free ( Belgian quote) And even then we put a price on it. Even leaving the EU alone, results in the UK setting up their own GPS alternative. That's a huge cost to bear alone

> UK setting up their own GPS alternative

The only reason this is possible is due to UK leadership in the area, so it's actually a brilliant opportunity for the UK to remain at the leading edge.

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#93

Post by Zigurd » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:10 PM UTC

dep_b wrote: post #69

Zigurd wrote: post #22

This is 21st c. social media-based warfare. Damaging the West with brexit and right wing nationalists is as strategically effective as a victory in a shooting war.

> Damaging the West with [...] right wing nationalists Ya if only we were as open minded as China and Russia we would win this war.

Putin loves, and supports, the right wing nationalists, and they love him back. https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2017/01/pu...

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#94

Post by freedomben » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:10 PM UTC

lazyjones wrote: post #50

SmellyGeekBoy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UK is the 5th biggest economy in the world. Switzerland is 20th and Norway 30th. The UK has traditionally punched well above its weight economically, it will be interesting to see if we become just another Switzerland or Norway after Brexit rather than the world economic power that we are today. Being the banking capital of the EU is a huge contributing factor to that position, btw.

> The UK has traditionally punched well above its weight economically How is its trade balance doing lately? Not so good. https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/balance-of-trade > Being the banking capital of the EU is a huge contributing factor to that position, btw. I'm not sure what economic indicators you are talking about. Certainly none that reflects the actual well-being of the population.

I generally support Brexit, but I'm guessing for reasons much different than yours (I always favor decentralization as a way of increasing the power of the average citizen relative to their government). Maybe we agree?

The trade balance tho is not typically a good indicator of economic health, at least not how it's typically pitched: https://mises.org/wire/nonproblem-trade-deficit

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#95

Post by lazyjones » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:10 PM UTC

Latteland wrote: post #80

SmellyGeekBoy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UK is the 5th biggest economy in the world. Switzerland is 20th and Norway 30th. The UK has traditionally punched well above its weight economically, it will be interesting to see if we become just another Switzerland or Norway after Brexit rather than the world economic power that we are today. Being the banking capital of the EU is a huge contributing factor to that position, btw.

Here's a list of the top 10 est 2019 world economies. UK will go from #5 down to 7 for sure. If they actually suffer much trouble they'll fall further. #5 UK 2.982T, France 2.935T, India 2.934T. I forgot Brazil was so high, #9 at 2.095. https://www.focus-economics.com/blog/the-largest-economies-i...

> UK will go from #5 down to 7 for sure.

Mostly because of India's growth. So what? It's GDP we're talking about, a largely meaningless indicator nowadays.

UK is #27 in GDP (PPP) per capita rankings. India is #122.

Is it better to live in an economy with large GDP or better purchasing power? Is India somehow better off than the UK once it overtakes it by GDP due to population growth?

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#96

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:12 PM UTC

namdnay wrote: post #64

lazyjones wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The UK is proposing to leave the single market (in the best case) No, May wants to stay in the single market, the EU is refusing that option. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/single-market... This stubbornness on behalf of the EU will damage both sides economically and thus be corrected at some point when the current EU administration is replaced by a more reasonable one.

> May wants to stay in the single market, the EU is refusing that option If you can't have your cake and eat it too, it's not the baker's fault...

[deleted]

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#97

Post by NicoJuicy » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:13 PM UTC

growlist wrote: post #73

flexie wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So do virtually all other Northern and Western European countries. What you have that they don't have is the English language as the native language. Non UK lawyers (as me) chose to UK arbitration etc. because of the language, not because we trust your courts more than the German, French or Dutch courts. Yes, arbitration and other alternative dispute resolution mechanisms in most other countries could be conducted in…

You might find this of interest: https://www.qlts.com/blog/why-english-law-governs-most-inter...

> QLTS is the official fast-track route that enables foreign lawyers to qualify as solicitors in England and Wales.

Not really an independent opinion so it seems. It would surprise me if they suggested something else, considering their business.

Everyone can find someone to agree with on the internet :)

International people have been judged in "Den Haag" a lot more than anywhere else.

Here are my "opinionated" sources:

> The International Court of Justice (abbreviated ICJ)[1] is the principal judicial organ of the United Nations (UN). It settles legal disputes between member states and gives advisory opinions to authorized UN organs and specialized agencies. ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Court_of_Justi... )

> Theresa May has failed to get the EU to agree that Britain will retain a voice at the European court of justice in return for her concession that the Luxembourg court will retain a role in protecting citizens’ rights in the UK after Brexit. ( https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/07/brexit-uk-f... )

Personal: haven't ever heard a UK court settle for international affairs. Hague is the only one I remember from events ( eg. Khadaffi, Bemba, ... )

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#98

Post by lazyjones » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:13 PM UTC

Xylakant wrote: post #86

lazyjones wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The UK is proposing to leave the single market (in the best case) No, May wants to stay in the single market, the EU is refusing that option. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/single-market... This stubbornness on behalf of the EU will damage both sides economically and thus be corrected at some point when the current EU administration is replaced by a more reasonable one.

The UK could easily stay in the single market by officially canceling brexit. It’s even a unilateral decision. It’s just that you cannot pick the benefits of being a EU member while shedding the obligations. In that regard it’s no different from a good old fashioned British Club.

> It’s just that you cannot pick the benefits of being a EU member while shedding the obligations.

Of course you can, it's a matter of negotiations. UK has/had plenty of exemptions as EU member and Switzerland for example is not part of Schengen but in the single market.

It amazes me how people here think that the EU is somehow the entity that makes up all the rules. It's not, deals are bilateral.

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#99

Post by growlist » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:14 PM UTC

pjc50 wrote: post #90

growlist wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For many people it was about regaining control of borders and reducing immigration. Personally I'm willing to trade off being a little poorer in exchange for being a sovereign nation once again, although the current direction of travel makes it look like we will be getting Brino i.e. Brexit in name only, about which by the way I'm staggered at how blithely people are willing to discard democracy when the result doesn…

> regaining control of borders What does this actually mean specifically ? What policy changes do you want that you think you can't have within the EU? > sovereign nation once again The UK is sovereign. It's just made some international agreements to align with other countries. If you think the EU is bad for this, wait until you see things like TTIP: all of the legislative override, ability to sue the state in foreig…

A points based immigration policy would be a nice start.

> The UK is sovereign. It's just made some international agreements to align with other countries. If you think the EU is bad for this, wait until you see things like TTIP: all of the legislative override, ability to sue the state in foreign courts etc, and none of the democracy.

One wonders how those poor impoverished nations outside of the big trading blocs survive!

Re: $1T is leaving Britain because of Brexit

#100

Post by ticmasta » Mon, Jan 07, 2019, 5:14 PM UTC

growlist wrote: post #83

Loughla wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Money isn't the only thing in life. Disclaimer - I'm not trying to be hateful. That seems like a completely nonsense, garbage statement. Brexit is primarily about money and economics, from what I can tell on the outside looking in. So what was your purpose in writing that?

For many people it was about regaining control of borders and reducing immigration. Personally I'm willing to trade off being a little poorer in exchange for being a sovereign nation once again, although the current direction of travel makes it look like we will be getting Brino i.e. Brexit in name only, about which by the way I'm staggered at how blithely people are willing to discard democracy when the result doesn…

> sovereign nation once again

As a Canadian (and I imagine citizen of pretty much any non-european commonwealth country) I had to chuckle a bit. After being treated like a resource-extraction milking machine historically and then maintaining this pseudo-ceremonial allegiance to a royal head of state it seems funny for someone from the mothership to bemoan a loss of sovereignty and self-determination.

No ill-will intended, just struck me as humorous in what is in all other regards a very humorless situation...