Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App • Hacker News Board

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#91

Post by scarface74 » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:36 PM UTC

palidanx wrote: post #43

mcny wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you are an Apple engineer and can help get that shipped, I will buy you a nice dinner. If you're an Apple recruiter, hire me so I can help ship it! :) Not that I know anything not known publicly but I suspect the reason Apple iOS Safari does not have Web Push API is not because they lack developer resources to write the code to get it done. Apple is under tremendous pressure to increase revenue from its "service…

Wouldn't you say though if that push notifications were allowed PWAs would cannibalize the revenue of the ios app store? It doesn't seem like apple would have much incentive to do this as PWAs would eventually compete with their own platform.

Apple makes most of its app revenue from in app purchases and most of that is for consumables for games.

The types of apps that could be a PWA wouldnt make Apple any money.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#92

Post by kkhire » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:37 PM UTC

verbify wrote: post #29

That's my feelings, although I've seen so many successful app-only startups that I feel I'm missing something that these startups grasp. E.g. in the UK Monzo, an app-only bank, won't allow you to access your statements, do transfers, or pretty much do anything to manage your account on the web, and is one of the most popular challenger banks.

this article is great advice for solo or small group of devs to test the concept first. a startup with funding or any company with tons of rev has plenty of money to plunge into the proper mobile dev team and also do user research to see what they'd want to have in the app to use it.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#93

Post by fromdowntown » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:38 PM UTC

wuliwong wrote: post #73

orev wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a user notifications are a problem, but as an app developer they absolutely work to drive engagement, which is why so many apps use them. So if you’re trying to run a business that’s a pretty important thing.

You think notifications are universally "a problem"? I find many notifications to be quite useful. Appointment reminders are VERY important to me and not at all a problem.

They probably mean generally a problem. Things like reminders seems like a good use case, but with all the apps trying to increase engagement, it seems necessary to mute notifications to an app right after downloading it.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#94

Post by beefalo » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:38 PM UTC

neonhat wrote: post #68

wvenable wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is wishful thinking with no logical argument behind it. WebAssembly replaces JavaScript but the rest of the experience (a web browser) is exactly the same. What would compel users to care?

> This is wishful thinking with no logical argument behind it. 1. A web app developed using WebAssembly offers performance indistinguishable from that of a native app. 2. Since the web app offers native performance, there's practically no need for a native app to exist in the first place. Why should developers waste their time developing for multiple platforms when a single mobile app works flawlessly? 3. This is gre…

Javascript is already fast enough for native apps as can be seen with things like cordova. Even with WebAssemply the layout and ui draw will still need a browser engine which is where the real difference between native and mobile is.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#95

Post by saagarjha » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:38 PM UTC

timdavila wrote: post #54

plexicle wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chrome on Android will show a banner to add it to your home screen.

True, the situation on Android is much better than iOS. Also after you do this, you get an icon in your app drawer and not just the homescreen.

iOS doesn’t have an app drawer, so I’m not quite sure where you’re going with your comparison…

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#96

Post by M2Ys4U » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:38 PM UTC

billmalarky wrote: post #44

noobiemcfoob wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too many applications abuse notifications and background processing anyway. If you need those features, you have to convince of far more value before I'll install a thing.

I'd wager you are not a great representation of the market that 99% of apps serve. Apps abuse those features because it works well for their business.

>Apps abuse those features because it works well for their business.

In the short-run anyway...

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#97

Post by scarface74 » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:40 PM UTC

shams93 wrote: post #2

Given the fact that most people are already maxed out on apps on their device with just things like facebook and youtube, you're going to be hard pressed to get people to install your app just to try it out. With a progressive web app if they like your app they can add it to their device home screen without installing via the app store and without using up space on their device. Also don't need to pay Apple $100 a ye…

Given the fact that most people are already maxed out on apps on their device with just things like facebook and youtube, you're going to be hard pressed to get people to install your app just to try it out.

https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/01/app-store-caps-record...

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#98

Post by wvenable » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:41 PM UTC

johnday wrote: post #72

wvenable wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Web hosting will cost more than $99/year so not all the costs of the web application are factored into this article.

Sure, but there's a bit of apples and oranges here - for example, any modern internet-connected app would also need a server backend.

But once we talking about that money, $100 a year is peanuts.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#99

Post by M2Ys4U » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:41 PM UTC

sgt wrote: post #65

"No one wants to download apps anymore" I stopped reading there. The major advantage of the App Store (primarily for consumer apps though) is the fact that there's some kind of filtering at place. If I find a quality app, I want to actually pay for it. In fact, if it's a good app - then I prefer to pay, as it often ensures some kind of continuity in the app's lifecycle.

> The major advantage of the App Store (primarily for consumer apps though) is the fact that there's some kind of filtering at place.

Hah. Maybe when nearly every app doesn't have a dozen trackers pinging off before the app has even opened you can talk.

Re: Start with a Website, Not a Mobile App

#100

Post by guntars » Fri, Jan 04, 2019, 5:42 PM UTC

wvenable wrote: post #33

verbify wrote: post #29

That's my feelings, although I've seen so many successful app-only startups that I feel I'm missing something that these startups grasp. E.g. in the UK Monzo, an app-only bank, won't allow you to access your statements, do transfers, or pretty much do anything to manage your account on the web, and is one of the most popular challenger banks.

Most of the points in the article are for the benefit of the developer (easier updating, lower dev cost, fewer platforms) and not for the benefit of the end user. If the goal is to make a product better for yourself then make a web application. If your goal is to make a product users will like then make mobile applications. The article talks about how users don't install apps but signing up for a website (enter email…

Just because everyone and their mother adds a signup flow just to be able to use their web app doesn't mean it has to be done that way. You can add the signup flow after you've already demonstrated the value to the user and when it would provide additional value, like saving things to your account.

An anonymous user on the web is equivalent to some anonymous user downloading your app from the app store.