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Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

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Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#51

Post by Qworg »

gaius wrote: post #43
bilbo0s wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Hey if you like my stuff consider adding my to your monthly payments.... Banks specifically DON'T want you doing that because they don't want undesirable businesses funneling money in and out of their banks. I'm sure there are different legal liabilities for different places for different undesirable businesses with that kind of thing. It's probably a potential minefield to let anyone do that indiscriminately. Pro…

Banks specifically DON'T want you doing that because they don't want undesirable businesses funneling money in and out of their banks Not sure I understand this objection - the recipient of such a transfer would already have to have an account at another bank, and that bank would have to do the full AML/KYC checks anyway. There should be no issues with someone with an account at reputable bank A sending a regular pay…

Banks don't necessarily trust each other and "I thought the other guy did KYC/AML" isn't a defense when the Feds show up.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#52

Post by EGreg »

blhack wrote: post #34
StudentStuff wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like they should have hooked up with a real payment provider. If InfoWars can get one for their store (through First Data even, much cheaper than PayPal), no reason SubscribeStar couldn't.

I'm surprised infowars hasnt created their own patreon clone.

Wasn’t Jordan Peterson gonna launch one before Christmas?

https://amp.businessinsider.com/jordan-peterson-says-hell-la...

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#53

Post by cm2187 »

manfredo wrote: post #6
Waterluvian wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most bizarre part, to me, is that it feels like this should just be a part of modern banking. "Hey if you like my stuff consider adding my to your monthly payments. I guess Patreon provides a walled garden of premium content for patrons, but I'm skeptical that's universally desired by creators. The few I know don't do any of that.

I think the core of Patreon's value is tying the payment to exclusive contents and access to patrons-only forums. That's why I think WordPress or SquareSpace would be suited to capturing Patreon's market. Creators can already create web stores in SquareSpace, it shouldn't be too much work on top of it to create recurring payments. It'd be more work, though, to wall off certain portions of the site to different paymen…

But what is the interest of the creator to this gamification? I would think the only effect could be to turn off users who wish to contribute then see a large amount of contributions already and think they don’t really need my money.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#54

Post by mirimir »

georgemcbay wrote: post #48
mirimir wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True. But he just tweeted today, and it quickly hit HN front page.

I agree with your basic point about not grabbing the pitchforks out just yet, but wouldn't it be nice if online businesses had to be accountable in a reasonable timeframe to all of their customers (especially when it comes to handling money that is due to the customer) and not just people who happen to have large twitter followings?

Well, I actually would expect someone to be checking Twitter and HN ;)

But maybe they've given up paying attention, given the other stuff going on. Or maybe overwhelmed and frustrated.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#55

Post by cm2187 »

bilbo0s wrote: post #18
Waterluvian wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The most bizarre part, to me, is that it feels like this should just be a part of modern banking. "Hey if you like my stuff consider adding my to your monthly payments. I guess Patreon provides a walled garden of premium content for patrons, but I'm skeptical that's universally desired by creators. The few I know don't do any of that.

> "Hey if you like my stuff consider adding my to your monthly payments.... Banks specifically DON'T want you doing that because they don't want undesirable businesses funneling money in and out of their banks. I'm sure there are different legal liabilities for different places for different undesirable businesses with that kind of thing. It's probably a potential minefield to let anyone do that indiscriminately. Pro…

How is that different from bank transfers or credit card numbers? It just reduces the risk of fraud by only sharing a token that can’t be used for anything else. If anything it cuts the middle man and allows the bank to capture a greater share of the fees.

The problem is that it has to be international.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#56

Post by cm2187 »

denkmoon wrote: post #4
manfredo wrote: post #2

Patreon sounds like something relatively easy to replicate. Effectively every utility implements what patron provides. It's essentially just scheduling recurring payments, with a discussion forum attached. More behavior like what we've been seeing Patreon do lately, and I can see larger creators shifting to hosing their own patronage services. Essentially the same reason why EA, Blizzard, and even more niche game pub…

Hopefully someone brings forth a patreon replacement. I'm not keen on how they've been acting in the last month and I kind of want to close my account, but I also want to continue supporting the groups I support.

2 of the 3 I was supporting offered alternatives. You might want to check their websites.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#57

Post by mirimir »

Being someone who pays ~zero attention to Twitter, and very little to "politics", I had no clue that there was a shitstorm happening over "censorship" by Patreon. (Although I think that it probably is censorship, I'm not sure, so scare quotes.)

Anyway, so searx.me shows me a NY Times article from today.[0] And it contains these ironic bits:

> Patreon takes a highly personal approach to policing speech. While Google and Facebook use algorithms as a first line of defense for questionable content, Patreon has human moderators. They give warnings and reach out to talk to offenders, presenting options for “education” and “reform.” Some activists hope this will become a model for a better and kinder internet. [emphasis added]

> “There are no automated takedowns,” Mr. Conte said. “As a creator myself dealing with these big tech platforms and getting an automated takedown notice, there’s no appeals process. You can’t talk to a human. And I never want to do that.” [emphasis added]

Funny, that.

Edit: And if this is truly a " fraud / financial flag", wouldn't one expect to see the same level of outreach?

0) https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/24/technology/patreon-hate-s...

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#58

Post by Erlich_Bachman »

blhack wrote: post #36

This same story played out 10 or so years ago with Wikileaks, PayPal, and major card processors and banks. The sad realization was that private companies can control who gets to speak very effectively. Lots of people hoped cryptocurrency would fix this, but so far it hasn't.

In technological terms, cryptocurrencies really have fixede this. However, the adoption is lacking behind somewhat. However, the few creators that do use cryptocurrency (even just in a rudimentary way of putting a bitcoin address in a video) - have gained from this.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#59

Post by Erlich_Bachman »

ploggingdev wrote: post #38

Like someone else suggested, this is likely a case of automated flagging by fraud detection systems, but it does not excuse such terrible communication on Patreon's part. I have been following the recent Patreon backlash with interest, which I think was triggered by Patreon banning a youtuber who goes by Sargon of Akkad for using the phrase "white [n-word]" in a youtube video. Sam Harris, who was one of the highest e…

But notifying the owner is not a part of automated flagging? How hard is it to make it send out a short e-mail? This is basically very bad care and support for clients, however one spins it.

Re: Patreon suspended my account. They have not notified me

#60

Post by StreamBright »

sublupo wrote: post #25
manfredo wrote: post #2

Patreon sounds like something relatively easy to replicate. Effectively every utility implements what patron provides. It's essentially just scheduling recurring payments, with a discussion forum attached. More behavior like what we've been seeing Patreon do lately, and I can see larger creators shifting to hosing their own patronage services. Essentially the same reason why EA, Blizzard, and even more niche game pub…

SubscribeStar tried to do that exact thing, and they succeeded for a little while. Then PayPal decided to freeze their account. My guess is because many people started to contact PayPal and said that SubscribeStar wasn't censoring people with wrong-think like Patreon just started to do.

The tricky part of any Patreon like service is the payment. I guess somebody has to create one with Alipay and many other alternative payment providers to Paypal to have a truly free service. I would even consider some sort of crypto currency use here (this would be an excellent use case).
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