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Jack Ma: US wasted trillions on warfare instead of investing in infrastructure

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Re: Jack Ma: US wasted trillions on warfare instead of investing in infrastructure

#201

Post by taobility »

floren wrote: post #159
taobility wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you remind me of this incident as a joke: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Washington_train_derailme...

Hmm yes, this is exactly the same sort of situation: > WSDOT announced on December 21 that it would not resume Amtrak service on the Point Defiance Bypass until positive train control is implemented in 2018. "But America has also had train crashes" is a typical response in this sort of situation, but also typically irrelevant.

As a software engineer, I knew the bug in every software is inevitable. What we should do is learning from each bug and try to find a solution to avoid repeat the mistake, either by some engineering process, or more tests. And blindly blame the engineer who wrote the codes is stupid.

Re: Jack Ma: US wasted trillions on warfare instead of investing in infrastructure

#202

Post by donaldknuth123 »

mythrwy wrote: post #198
donaldknuth123 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good idea for whom is what you should be asking. That money wasn't burned, it was sent to the bank accounts of major stockholders in Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, Halliburton etc... Lets be very clear, there are people who benefited and still benefit greatly from US Military spending.

As there are people who benefit from bank robbery. After all, the money is still around to be spent by the bank robbers. But it's still theft from the system and is a transfer of purchasing power from those who produce to those who do not. Or in case of military contractors, from those who produce to those who destroy. Professionally.

I'm not opining on the morality of it, just saying that the idea that the money disappeared or was put in a pile and burnt is obviously silly.

Re: Jack Ma: US wasted trillions on warfare instead of investing in infrastructure

#203

Post by barrow-rider »

marnett wrote: post #126
achou wrote: post #116

Folks, realize that US military spending: - backstops the US dollar as the world's reserve currency, which allows the US to have a large deficit with low risk to its economic system, which basically means the US can ship paper to other countries and they will send real stuff back to us in return. Let's not kid ourselves, this has a lot to do with the US' large military and financial advantage. - makes opportunistic a…

Sure we can all acknowledge those are all deeply complex and intertwined facts about the U.S. and its military strategy and spending. Foreign policy, both diplomatic and militaristic, are also not democratic - I think some people just want to call out "the worlds exemplar of democracy" spending the largest portion of its budget on undemocratic means. We The People want to see something more meaningful domestically fr…

> spending the largest portion of its budget on undemocratic means

That is just simply not true. The largest part of the US budget is ~1.25 trillion USD spent on Social Security and Unemployment, after that it's ~1 trillion on Medicare & Medicade, and ~600 billion on Defense.

Make no mistake the US spends wayyyy too much on the military, but it's not #1

Re: Jack Ma: US wasted trillions on warfare instead of investing in infrastructure

#204

Post by mythrwy »

donaldknuth123 wrote: post #202
mythrwy wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As there are people who benefit from bank robbery. After all, the money is still around to be spent by the bank robbers. But it's still theft from the system and is a transfer of purchasing power from those who produce to those who do not. Or in case of military contractors, from those who produce to those who destroy. Professionally.

I'm not opining on the morality of it, just saying that the idea that the money disappeared or was put in a pile and burnt is obviously silly.

Except some of it _literally_ went up in flames.

Have you seen the footage of bombing of ISIS cash dump with US currency flying out? Guess the pallets of dollars going over there for reconstruction was the source.

It's a waste. Waste of spending, waste of effort, waste of resources. The human effort and material spent on that endeavor could have done a lot for this country.

Also morality aside, if we are empire, if we are going to police the world, we are doing so in a very unsustainable fashion.

This is just what I can't help but see. Maybe I'm wrong. Not really trying to argue but damn, this a big elephant of wasteful effort and resource allocation.

Re: Jack Ma: US wasted trillions on warfare instead of investing in infrastructure

#205

Post by atonse »

JackFr wrote: post #88
atonse wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This kind of blind exceptionalism is exactly why nothing ever moves here. We are stuck in 30 years ago of "we're so much better than everyone" that we're refusing to see how our lead has quickly worsened, and also attacking the messenger's background instead of taking the message to heart. I think we're still leaders in education, for example, but that's under threat. China has built thousands of miles of high speed…

> We are stuck in 30 years ago of "we're so much better than everyone" that we're refusing to see how our lead has quickly worsened Those who have lived through the scares geopolitical threat of the Cold War in the 1970's, and the economic threat of Japan Inc. in the 1980's can be a little more circumspect about the growing Chinese "threat". I don't have illusions about "we're so much better", but we do have somethin…

I agree with that in general, by the way, at least in theory. But those institutions have been tested like crazy in the past few years, to the point where fundamental things are changing (some immigrants going to other countries like Canada, etc).

I just think it's depressing to think that we've built zero miles, ZERO miles of high speed rail in 10 years, when China built 8,000.

Let's be realistic, it's China's embrace of capitalism through Special Economic Zones that's truly led to their vibrant economic growth. So I'm not advocating for central planning. I'm just saying that resting on our laurels based on the idea that America was once so far ahead, without realizing that we're not THAT far ahead anymore, is a mistake. (seems like you're saying similar things though)

Re: Jack Ma: US wasted trillions on warfare instead of investing in infrastructure

#207

Post by dplgk »

baby wrote: post #72

Another weird thing to me, as a foreigner in the US, is the fascination people have for the "troops".

People are not generally fascinated by the troops. "The troops" is a political trope thrown around to try to squash any criticism of the military, its funding, its missions or anything remotely related to it. It's a sound bite that conservatives proudly trot around to deflect dissenting views.
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