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Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

latimes.com

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Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#131

Post by lawlessone »

semi-extrinsic wrote: post #114
semi-extrinsic wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh, TIL Tesla Autopilot only works at speeds below 50 mph. I thought it was mainly for highway driving, but highways are more like 60-100 mph. I assumed it worked at highway speeds. What gives?

My mistake, I had to search for the max Autosteer speed and Google gave me an old article. Seems they have been upgrading steadily from 45 mph in January 2017 to (currently) 90 mph? But then my original question remains: why do they need guide wheels for this, when they can do 90 mph without them on normal roads?

>why do they need guide wheels for this, when they can do 90 mph without them on normal roads?

The tunnel in the article is very narrow. Imagine trying to drive at 90mph through a car wash without touching the sides.

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#132

Post by Luc »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #130
konschubert wrote: post #103

If they manage to reduce the cost of tunnel boring then that's super exciting and I congratulate them. But all this discussion of what to put in the tunnel seems very silly to me. Are they just re-discovering subways? Do they know that there are subways in the world (e.g. Paris) that run out rubber tires?

Tunneling is currently so expensive that there are few companies doing any innovation on how to properly utilize them. A big part of the problem is actually digging them in a way that is cheap and scaleable. Another part of the problem is the organizations doing the digging and doing the exploitation are typically have misaligned incentives and goals. For example, expanding subway systems is currently in the hands of…

You're comparing a difficult but real situation with a perfect but hypothetical one.

Things always are wonderful when they're research projects that don't need to conform to real-world limitations.

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#133

Post by otorrillas »

konschubert wrote: post #107
Crosseye_Jack wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> guide wheels that can be attached to the front tires of autonomous, electric cars, steadying the vehicles as they move forward through tunnels." So the o-Bahn Busways in Aus, just underground.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O-Bahn_Busway https://youtu.be/X89WSVjyBRw

Guys, guys, hear me out. I have a crazy idea. What if we use special cars only for the tunnel with some kind of ride sharing system? and then we put the cars on rails? This keeps them on track and also the rolling friction is much lower. Also, we could continuously charge the battery of the car if we have some kind of wire going alongside the tunnel and a slip contact. Actually we could make the cars much bigger as w…

It looks like you've just invented the underground...

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#134

Post by xvilka »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #130
konschubert wrote: post #103

If they manage to reduce the cost of tunnel boring then that's super exciting and I congratulate them. But all this discussion of what to put in the tunnel seems very silly to me. Are they just re-discovering subways? Do they know that there are subways in the world (e.g. Paris) that run out rubber tires?

Tunneling is currently so expensive that there are few companies doing any innovation on how to properly utilize them. A big part of the problem is actually digging them in a way that is cheap and scaleable. Another part of the problem is the organizations doing the digging and doing the exploitation are typically have misaligned incentives and goals. For example, expanding subway systems is currently in the hands of…

Apart from pointing at Asian nations building subways in almost every big city, it might also worth a look to the Arab Peninsula, with also very high speed of digging and building required infrastructure. It is only US who is behind at this sadly.

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#135

Post by [deleted] »

lawlessone wrote: post #131
semi-extrinsic wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mistake, I had to search for the max Autosteer speed and Google gave me an old article. Seems they have been upgrading steadily from 45 mph in January 2017 to (currently) 90 mph? But then my original question remains: why do they need guide wheels for this, when they can do 90 mph without them on normal roads?

>why do they need guide wheels for this, when they can do 90 mph without them on normal roads? The tunnel in the article is very narrow. Imagine trying to drive at 90mph through a car wash without touching the sides.

[deleted]

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#136

Post by C1sc0cat »

tlrobinson wrote: post #24
warent wrote: post #4

> "But Musk told reporters that Boring officials have abandoned the concept of the skate, saying it was “far more complex” than his new plan: guide wheels that can be attached to the front tires of autonomous, electric cars, steadying the vehicles as they move forward through tunnels." So basically this only works with Tesla vehicles at the moment. I'm wondering how that's going to expand in the future--if at all. Do…

> Musk played a simulation showing the wheels folding neatly underneath the car’s undercarriage when not in use. Adding them during assembly or after-market would cost $200 to $300, he said, and would not interfere with the vehicle’s normal operation.

Folding wheels .. right

I can see some interesting failure modes where the wheels fold up in normal driving. Yeh I know its not supposed to happen but one Uk maker had steering wheels that could come off whilst driving - this was used in my mech eng course as a cautionary example.

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#137

Post by rsynnott »

agildehaus wrote: post #120
warent wrote: post #4

> "But Musk told reporters that Boring officials have abandoned the concept of the skate, saying it was “far more complex” than his new plan: guide wheels that can be attached to the front tires of autonomous, electric cars, steadying the vehicles as they move forward through tunnels." So basically this only works with Tesla vehicles at the moment. I'm wondering how that's going to expand in the future--if at all. Do…

Doesn't the removal of the skate also put the vehicle's speed back in the hands of the driver? So now one slow guy will slow down everyone in that tunnel? Also, the skate was supposed to provide the automation. How does autonomously navigate the tunnel network?

It's a Musk thing; not sure why you necessarily expect it to make any sense.

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#138

Post by nickik »

garmaine wrote: post #124
Isinlor wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He may have delays, but what have he failed to deliver? Everything is either work in progress or delivered. - internet payment platform, check - first privately founded company to do orbital launch, check - reusable cheap rockets, check - biggest rocket available + it's reusable, check - Dragon spacecraft, check - crew spacecraft, check (still needs testing, starting early next year) - Model S, check - Model X, check…

I'm a Musk fan, but literally 90%+ of the things Musk say never actually happen, or happen very late, or have so radically changed in the process as to be something different. You're just quoting the successes, not all the things that he's claimed to be working on in the history of his career. I suspect one of the reasons journalists are so unfairly critical of him is that the story keeps changing. As an engineer I k…

These 'journalists' are the ones who make a choice to comment and report on him. If they want to report news that is known and understood by everybody to be a best case, its their own fault.

Musk is interesting in the first place because he is not a typical boring CEO. So they want to use him as clickbait, but then they get shitty if its not 'polished' like what they get sent from the PR departments of other companies.

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#139

Post by rsynnott »

reissbaker wrote: post #49
Tiktaalik wrote: post #36

What a gong show and waste of everyone's time. https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1075230308545454080 How can this man honestly think this sort of system could be higher capacity than a subway?

I'm not sure what you're purporting to show other than two people disagreeing with each other, without providing evidence... Sure, an individual subway car has "more capacity," but does a subway system have more capacity? For example, I rarely see BART trains come within five minutes of each other. A tunnel that allows cars within 10 seconds of each other could provide more capacity than a tunnel with higher-density…

> Sure, an individual subway car has "more capacity," but does a subway system have more capacity? For example, I rarely see BART trains come within five minutes of each other.

The BART is a particularly poor example. There are _tram_ systems (ie partially-segregated rail) which do better than once every five minutes.

Re: Elon Musk Unveils Boring Co's First Tunnel

#140

Post by xvilka »

Skye wrote: post #119
Rebelgecko wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that for sure? It looks like it'd be a tight fit for a train.

There are trains that run in narrow tunnels in London (12 feet wide I think?). https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Why_London_Undergrou...

They have a huge problem with overheating because of the small gap between roof and a tunnel, it also reduces potential speed of the train.
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