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Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

theintercept.com

211–220 of 372 posts

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#211
post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How good is Yandex indexing and search technology?...My guess is that probably not even close to Google, and heavily optimized for slavic inflections and cyrilic.

Why do you think so? Yandex has 2% search market share in South Korea, that's not big but Baidu has less than 5% there, so it's comparable.

I am not aware of any single South Korean who has used either Yandex or Baidu. They don't even support Korean at all, so why would any Korean bother to use them? Very interested in the source of your statistics, which I guess completely incorrect.

http://gs.statcounter.com/search-engine-market-share/all/sou... https://www.opensurvey.co.kr/blog/trendreport/sns_2018/ http://www.internettrend.co.kr/trendForward.tsp

As far as I know, there's no report which shows Yandex's significance in South Korean search engine market share.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#213
post #80

> Scott Beaumont, Google’s leader in China and a key architect of the Dragonfly project, “did not feel that the security, privacy, and legal teams should be able to question his product decisions,” If I was more eloquent I'd draw some analogy between Scott Beaumont's behavior and China...

> I'd draw some analogy between Scott Beaumont's behavior and China

You could be just as likely to draw the analogy with the USA.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#214
It's interesting, because if The Intercept is to be believed, Beaumont has basically gone rogue, carving out his own little empire, aggressively preventing other internal teams from figuring out what he's doing, and engaging in behaviour that violates internal Google rules and policies, as well as which opening Google to significant reputational risk.

I mean, I'll be the first to admit I have made mistakes in my career, but I can't recall ever making a mistake that got my boss called in to testify before Congress, or that got my company prptested by Amnesty International, or that got hundreds of my colleagues to sign a letter of protest! Managing to do all of those at once is...well, honestly it's sort of impressive, but is raises questions.

If The Intercept is just completely wrong, I'd expect to see a categorical denial; after all it would make Google look a lot better if they can convincingly demonstrate that all of this didn't actually happen. If The Intercept is right, I'd expect to see Beaumont fired; that's what happens when people violate internal rules and cause significant damage to their employer as a result.

Since we've seen neither...I guess the logical assumption is that The Intercept was right about what Beaumont was doing, but he...wasn't rogue? That official Google policy was to subvert official Google policy, and hide things from the internal teams charged with stopping that exact thing? Like...is the CEO really having meetings with the privacy team and telling them to be extra vigilant not to let product teams misuse personal data, and then later that afternoon meeting with Beaumont and telling him to be extra careful not to let the privacy team find out that he's misusing personal data to develop a product?

What a bizarre situation.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#215

This is a great loss to Chinese people who have to use worse products such as Baidu and so.com. I was hoping Google's re-entering could result in a better Internet (or Intranet) ecosystem in China but alas...

It could be worse. At least Bing is still in China, although I don't know any locals who use it.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#216
post #80

> Scott Beaumont, Google’s leader in China and a key architect of the Dragonfly project, “did not feel that the security, privacy, and legal teams should be able to question his product decisions,” If I was more eloquent I'd draw some analogy between Scott Beaumont's behavior and China...

I'm sorry, but almost every peace of information about Dragonfly we have is from the intercept, which has for source people who clearly are very biased against the project. So while we can come up with dozens of rumors that shine it in a very bad light, I'm not sure how fair that is, since we're missing the other half of the story.

With enough selective "facts", I can make almost anything look bad.

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#217
post #214

It's interesting, because if The Intercept is to be believed, Beaumont has basically gone rogue, carving out his own little empire, aggressively preventing other internal teams from figuring out what he's doing, and engaging in behaviour that violates internal Google rules and policies, as well as which opening Google to significant reputational risk. I mean, I'll be the first to admit I have made mistakes in my care…

Google is large enough to not be a monolith culture have you considered this

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#218
post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to the rumors, Dragonfly goes far beyond censorship, in that it has provisions to identify specific people from search queries. So it's not just that searching for "Tiananmen Square" wouldn't give any useful results, but it'd also let the Big Brother know who was inappropriately curious. Combine this with their upcoming social credit system, and you can easily see how this is proactively helping build an au…

It's what all companies there are required to do and the Chinese people accept it, and a lot of them welcome the social credit system (according to reporting on the program) it's arrogant to to presume we know what's best for them.

Turns out you seem to not believe in your own moral values as your are ready to give them up

Re: Google’s Secret China Project “Effectively Ended” After Internal Confrontation

#219
post #98

Never really understood why Google running a search engine in China is controversial, it wouldn't be the first US company doing business there, nor the first to censor due to local laws (Apple censors their app store etc) and it's not like tiananmen square queries will be the bulk of their traffic.

I don't know how old you are, but google blossomed under the guise of "do no evil", that is why its controversial.

Maybe I'm lacking in morality but I don't understand how serving censored content to people that already live in a society where the content is censored is considered evil.
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