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China’s Economy Slows Sharply

nytimes.com

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Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#111

Post by anoncoward111 »

triviatise wrote: post #31
anoncoward111 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's definitely an issue, but I would like to add that many of us feel the US govt too engages in lying through data. The biggest one in my mind is the unemployment rate. Even though Labor publishes nuanced statistics and revises them for accuracy, Trump and the media focus solely on the lowest tier of unemployment rate, which is the one below 4%. To be included in this rate, you must currently be receiving unemplo…

There are multiple levels of unemployment U1-U6, they go from the most liberal to the most conservative view unemployment. Ultimately the absolute number doesnt matter that much, it is the trends. The "official" number is the U3, but if you prefer to use the U6 you can. No one is lying about unemployment. U1:[47] Percentage of labor force unemployed 15 weeks or longer. U2: Percentage of labor force who lost jobs or c…

Did you not read my comment? I explicitly mentioned that there are multiple forms of unemployment statistics measures by Labor, and that workforce participation statistic is most accurate.

Yet, you will never ever hear these stats on TV or from Trump. It is solely just screaming about "RECORD LOW UNEMPLOYMENT", when it is anything but a healthy employment situation.

Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#112

Post by mruniverse »

HumanDrivenDev wrote: post #110
mruniverse wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah they shouldn't follow that history. The US also had slavery.

The US also had slavery. Are you under the impression that China didn't?

I was and I stand corrected.

I was trying to address the idea that since the US did bad things in the past, it's ok for other nations to do them too.

Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#113

Post by mruniverse »

vkou wrote: post #109
mruniverse wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are we talking the slavery ladder?

I'm talking about all the other 'unfair' trade practices that have been cited. If you don't want the developing world to follow in the West's footsteps, perhaps we should share some of our wealth with them? Would that be a more palpable alternative? Earlier today, a study was posted on HN about how the British Empire plundered ~$50T (inflation-adjusted) of wealth from India over it's colonial history. If you want to…

I think reparations are the way to go.

Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#114

Post by munificent »

vkou wrote: post #107
mruniverse wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah they shouldn't follow that history. The US also had slavery.

Great, so now that you're at the top, you want to pull the ladder up?

If "pulling the ladder up" includes things like "not allowing the world climate to be destroyed" or "preventing disregarding human rights violations and worker quality of life" then, yeah, probably.

Giving each country a fair shot at developing even if they didn't happen to get on that ramp at the same time as some Western countries is a good goal.

At the same time, that's not such a vital principle that we should sacrifice other moral or pragmatic imperatives to get it. China may have gotten a late start, but that doesn't give them the right to ignore everything we've learned since then about a country's obligations to its people and the world.

Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#116

Post by dana321 »

nosleeptill wrote: post #28

Having done business in China, and having friends still in China, as one of them put it, "China has more problems than you can count." China is really a complex house of cards, it looks more foreboding than it actually is in reality. The second the economy slows the consumers hide, and go back to stuffing cash into their mattresses. I think Trump is a fool, but in the case of China I think we need a fool. Trump belie…

Its not just China.

Here in the UK for the first time, i've seen multiple billboards with nothing but scraps on them (they've deleted the adverts by scraping the remnants off)

Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#117

Post by henrikschroder »

vkou wrote: post #109
mruniverse wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are we talking the slavery ladder?

I'm talking about all the other 'unfair' trade practices that have been cited. If you don't want the developing world to follow in the West's footsteps, perhaps we should share some of our wealth with them? Would that be a more palpable alternative? Earlier today, a study was posted on HN about how the British Empire plundered ~$50T (inflation-adjusted) of wealth from India over it's colonial history. If you want to…

> If you don't want the developing world to follow in the West's footsteps, perhaps we should share some of our wealth with them?

We are, it's called the global economy, and it has performed a wealth transfer of unprecedented scale these last decades.

> we have a lot of reparations to look forward to.

Colonial reparations are complete crock, because they are based on counterfactual history speculations, and there are absolutely no concrete limits on those.

The Roman empire obviously plundered the British isles for inflation-adjusted astronomical amounts during its colonial history, should modern-day Italians pay reparations to England?

It's absurd.

Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#118

Post by munificent »

jandrese wrote: post #76
CoolGuySteve wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happened in the early 90s recession when Japan pulled back on foreign investment? Did they cause the recession or were they wiped out by it? The only thing I remember as a teenager then was the Japanese briefly gaining and losing control of the NBC/GE conglomerate.

IIRC overall the Japanese lost their shirt on those deals and it lead to an entire lost decade economically. I would not be surprised at all to learn that the Chinese government was inflating figures for political purposes and are in trouble now that the chickens are coming home to roost. It's super tempting for authoritarian regimes to cook the books to look better internationally. There was also seemingly a belief…

Adding context to your comment: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Decade_(Japan)

Re: China’s Economy Slows Sharply

#119

Post by shanghaiaway »

friedman23 wrote: post #35
clomond wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that both of you can be right. The "Chinese government" is not a singular, monolithic entity in the same way the "US Government" is actually a bunch of departments, branches and jurisdiction levels each with competing and sometimes differing interests and goals. (but yes, it is more unified in China in the sticking to party line). The Chinese federal government has been wanting to make this re-bal…

> and shifts from inefficient state owned enterprises to companies that can operate more efficiently and are "market oriented") Do you have evidence of this? Isn't one of the biggest US complaints that many Chinese businesses are indistinguishable from the government?

You should be interested in reality rather than projections. Alibaba, Tencent, Baidu, Huawei, etc. are corporate entities separate from the Chinese government.
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