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Goodbye, EdgeHTML

blog.mozilla.org

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Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#421

Post by ehsankia »

severino wrote: post #136
babuskov wrote: post #8

If anyone told me a decade ago that a day will come when I will feel sorry for Microsoft browser technology going away...

Well, I think it's actually two different things: I don't feel bad at all seeing IE/Edge coming to an end. It was a closed, non free, single-platform browser, who gave a lot of people a lot of headaches during the last 20 years. On the other hand, I'm worried by the fact that Google browser market share continues to grow.

Honest question, what has Edge/IE actually contributed to the web in the past decade? I understand that having one less engine is not preferable, but realistically, it always felt like they were dragging behind struggling to keep up, while Apple, Google and Mozilla kept forging ahead.

By using Blink, maybe they can spend more time actually contributing to the spec and having an independent voice elsewhere?

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#422

Post by StillBored »

Well, I guess i'm going to miss edge, it wasn't a bad browser. it definitely felt faster than firefox...

OTOH, Microsoft did this to themselves. Back when MS actually tried to create a user friendly OS and listened to their users. IE was supported across the entire line of supported OSes. But then under Balmer, they started to use IE and directX (and a few other things) as hammers to force people to upgrade to more recent versions of windows. Combined with a string of moves which pissed of their users and developers has resulted in far more reticence to upgrade windows versions than happened in the win 2.x->windows ME cycle.

Now their applications are suffering because windows 10 is still less than 50% of the windows userbase. So, basically 50+% of windows users can't actually run edge. Similarly with games, A developer that exclusively targets directX 12 cuts out 50% of the windows market share (and a similar share of the game console market).

OTOH, both firefox and chrome work just fine on windows7/8, and somehow so does vulkan, meaning that a brand new game could just target that and gain the entire supported windows ecosystem, much of the mobile, and game machine markets.

Basically there is a layer of management at MS that needs to be fired, because they still think its the 1990's and MS can force any old crap on their user-base and they will suck it up. After all, what are the alternatives (this is sorta still true, both linux and macos are still subpar experiences too)?

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#423

Post by cglace »

tyteen4a03 wrote: post #165
rehemiau wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people won't switch because either Firefox is slow on their platform (MacOS) or stuff they use are slow on Firefox (Google ecosystem, many other webapps optimized for Chrome)

Yep, can confirm that FF is still killing my 2014 MBP.

Have a 2013 MBP and it runs fine for me.

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#424

Post by FooHentai »

baroffoos wrote: post #399
FooHentai wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just had to switch back to Chrome because firefox couldn't handle multiple (4+) 1080p x264 streams in the same window. Chrome managed to handle 18 of them, across two windows, without a hitch.

How often are you streaming 18 1080p streams at once?

Fair bit at the moment, am grinding marbles on stream.

But it's not the particular use-case that's the problem, it's the drastic difference in performance characteristics which is more of a sliding scale than a one-time issue. Firefox is pound-for-pound slower in general browsing activities for me, and chokes on javascript-heavy pages much quicker than Chrome. It's still an order of magnitude better than IE in that regard, but on a sliding scale, Chrome's out in the lead with FF somewhere in the middle.

I'm hanging on to FF for idealogical reasons, but that's it. If the browsing experience was my only measure, it'd be Chrome all the way.

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#425

Post by fireattack »

pseudalopex wrote: post #391
fireattack wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use Fx as my main browser, but the quick search feature in Fx is miles behind Chrome's. 1. In chrome, you don't need to manually add anything; you don't need to assign a keyword that you have to memorize. All the websites that you frequent that support OpenSearch will be automatically added by Chrome and you use their domain as keyword. I can now type en + tab to search on Wikipedia, as well as hundreds of other we…

You can add OpenSearch engines from the "..." menu in the address bar, but it doesn't show an indicator like the search bar. Suggestions for keyword searches will be fixed in the next release.[1] [1] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1496814

Thanks for the reply!

Unfortunately it doesn't fix the problem that I have to add keywords for all of them manually

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#426

Post by mixmastamyk »

adontz wrote: post #109

I am Firefox user for more than 15 years. I personally would prefer Firefox codebase to be adopted. I think Mozilla is the only big organization left who is pro-customer. But let's be realistic, people want things to "just work". People in general are not bothered by privacy or security, but if funny cat picture can't load that's huge problem. People in general were moving from IE because it's shitty laggish software…

> Mozilla… pro-customer.

Microsoft arguably isn't, they still like to force the customer to do things beneficial to itself, and collect lots of telemetry.

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#427

Post by npunt »

jeremija wrote: post #242
npunt wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Containers are such a great idea. My one wish is if you could set a default container. I use FF to browser Facebook primarily and want that to be default, but instead I have to load Firefox then load a container then load Facebook. Wish it were just open FF -> Facebook is homepage.

There is an option called "always open in this container" if you press the menu icon of the container tabs extension

Turns out this doesn't do the thing I'd expect. I set my homepage to Facebook and it doesn't load the container.

Eh, back to my former opinion - Containers are great, Containers UX needs work.

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#428

Post by blitmap »

davidp wrote: post #19

Seriously, switch to Firefox. It's good again, and prioritizes privacy.[0] After Chrome's forced-sign-in debacle [1] I switched away from Chrome on all my platforms (Windows, Linux, Android) and haven't missed a thing. [0]: https://hacks.mozilla.org/2018/11/firefox-sync-privacy/ [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18055161

I think Servo is going to be a massive Good Thing (tm) for Mozilla, but they have messed up a few times with UI anti-patterns and sneaking extensions into updates that users didn't opt for. They have seriously breached our trust like Google and it will take years to earn back that trust.

I switched to Firefox away from Chrome recently. I am happy with this but I wish they had a friendly UI you could bring up to expose cookies to be shared between tabs on an opt-in basis. Cookies should be isolated per-tab by default. Cookies and other persistent data should be forgotten as soon as the tab is closed. I don't like container tabs, I think it gets confusing to manage tab groups by profile. I want to quickly mouse over and say "expose this tab's cookies to this other tab".

I'm still sad I can't get perfect "tree tabs" going. I have a plugin I use to show parent and child tabs in a tree arrangement but nothing looks sexy about it:

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/tree-tabs/?sr...

I want an actual tree of lines shown to each row/tab to quickly visualize how the tabs were created from parent-to-child. How it currently looks is too busy with borders everywhere. It's functional but not what I envisioned. I can't hide the tab bar at the top as far as I know. I'm just frustrated that I remember trying to make this work in like 2002 and it's soon to be 2019. I feel like browsers aren't made for workstations, but casual consumption. They should enable so much productivity.

I also wish they focused on minimizing and isolating references to various Web APIs, so it would be easier to unreference and orphan them - unreachable from advertisers.

(Unrelated rant?)

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#429

Post by sazfedjhrgnukc »

sha666sum wrote: post #246
vrazj wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I don't think anybody wants the ads they have added to the home page.

Eh, at least it only takes a few clicks to remove them.

Eh, what does that say about Mozilla wanting to be the "good guy"? If they want to be good then they have to constantly be held accountable to the high standard they like people to think that they are at. They don't get their cake and eat it too.

Re: Goodbye, EdgeHTML

#430

Post by chmln »

blitmap wrote: post #428
davidp wrote: post #19

Seriously, switch to Firefox. It's good again, and prioritizes privacy.[0] After Chrome's forced-sign-in debacle [1] I switched away from Chrome on all my platforms (Windows, Linux, Android) and haven't missed a thing. [0]: https://hacks.mozilla.org/2018/11/firefox-sync-privacy/ [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18055161

I think Servo is going to be a massive Good Thing (tm) for Mozilla, but they have messed up a few times with UI anti-patterns and sneaking extensions into updates that users didn't opt for. They have seriously breached our trust like Google and it will take years to earn back that trust. I switched to Firefox away from Chrome recently. I am happy with this but I wish they had a friendly UI you could bring up to expos…

I'm afraid our hopes of Servo resurrecting Mozilla were short lived. From what I understand, work on Servo for Desktop has been phased out considerably.

See https://blog.servo.org/2018/03/09/servo-and-mixed-reality/

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