Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Lyft Files for IPO

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 319 posts

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#61

Post by njarboe »

mhneu wrote: post #46
ghaff wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When Kalanick was booted, I actually did expect the board to call a timeout and take a hard look at the business model while admitting that self-driving, especially in places that actually have enough density to make taxi-type services generally of interest, is a red herring. It's too far out and it's not clear what the implications are anyway. It's not like Uber and Lyft aren't still a useful service at 1.5x to 2x c…

If Uber and Lyft prices go up 1.5x to 2x, that suddenly means that in cities, taxis undercut them. I'll let someone chime in who understands the taxi business financials better. But in my observations, Uber and Lyft are only slightly cheaper than taxis. If prices go up, taxi companies will cut into their profits. I'll also say we (as a society) are very lucky that Lyft emerged as a real competitor to Uber. If one of…

"Uber and Lyft are only slightly cheaper than taxis"

A taxi from my home to/from the airport is $50-$55 with tip. Uber is $20-$25 non surge (which is most of the time). Before Uber, on an outbound I would always have a friend take me or drop me at BART. On the return, since the taxi is right there, I would take it about half the time.

Now I take Uber/Lyft almost all the time. I'm not sure what I'll do when/if Uber goes up to $50.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#62

Post by SilasX »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #27

Funny that Uber/Lyft get categorized as "ride-hailing" when they specifically don't allow you to hail a cab, only request one in advance. But the alternative seems to be "ride-sharing", which is utter feel-good bullshit outside of the small percentage who use Uber Pool or Lyft Line, so I suppose it's the best we've got.

Hm, I had always heard "street hail" to refer to what (I think) you mean, when you request it by line-of-sight, not "hail" by itself.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#63

Post by docker_up »

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free.

Uber has a global operations, is in multiple streams of business and has diversity across business lines and countries so even if there's a recession in one country, it might be made up for in other countries.

So what's the investment story then for Lyft?

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#64

Post by CPLX »

a13n wrote: post #56
RandallBrown wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would ridesharing be winner take all? There's almost no network effect (beyond splitting the cost, but Venmo has largely solved that) and the drivers all drive for all of them. In NYC I think there's at least 4 ridesharing companies and I usually choose which one based on which one has given me a promo.

There are plenty of network effects. To start a new ridesharing company, you have to get drivers and riders. You'd have to offer them a ton of incentives to start driving/riding with your service, when the existing options are well established. For drivers, Lyft and Uber have incentives (lower fees) if you do the majority of rides with their service, which incentivizes you to only drive with one service. When's the l…

This is just not correct.

To start a new ridesharing company all you have to do is attack and carve off the most profitable element of the big company's product mix.

All you need is to undercut them in certain high profitability routes, like airport runs, or luxury vehicles for executives, or anything, and you have a toehold.

There are some positive network effects, but there are also negative network effects. Having more users doesn't mean you always win as the big company.

For example if you have no customers all you have to do is be outside of a stadium at the end of a show, or waiting by an airport during a busy landing period, and have rudimentary abilities to let people know you exist, and you'll get defectors.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#65

Post by empath75 »

docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Why would anyone invest in Pepsi over Coca-Cola? Why invest in Apple over Microsoft? Why invest in Tesla over GM?

There can be more than one successful company in a segment.

Also, well, you can't invest in Uber.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#66

Post by jameslevy »

lallysingh wrote: post #22
wbl wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too easy to enter the market, at least in a small area for price fixing to work.

This exactly. I think eventually we could see a Kayak-like service that just compares rates for your trip against a set and books accordingly. Containing Uber/Lyft/local taxi service/etc. It's very easy to enter the market. You just need a map in a UI (mapbox) and a way to charge people (stripe/square). There's probably a decent market for transportation-service-as-a-service. $1000 gets you all setup with a custom ap…

The only way Uber and Lyft will allow themselves to be relegated to a "dumb pipes" role is if they are forced to with regulation. Otherwise, zero chance of this happening.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#67

Post by toomuchtodo »

lewis500 wrote: post #55
RandallBrown wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would ridesharing be winner take all? There's almost no network effect (beyond splitting the cost, but Venmo has largely solved that) and the drivers all drive for all of them. In NYC I think there's at least 4 ridesharing companies and I usually choose which one based on which one has given me a promo.

There is a network effect. Imagine if you made a ridesharing app with only one driver. No one would use the app due to high wait times. That's an edge case but it gets the point across: too few drivers and no one will use your app, and if no one uses the app no drivers will enlist in your service.

Users already have to make arrangements with traditional car services for early AM airport runs because there is no Uber of Lyft supply in most areas (outside of NYC, SF, LA).

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#68

Post by lalaithion »

lewis500 wrote: post #55
RandallBrown wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would ridesharing be winner take all? There's almost no network effect (beyond splitting the cost, but Venmo has largely solved that) and the drivers all drive for all of them. In NYC I think there's at least 4 ridesharing companies and I usually choose which one based on which one has given me a promo.

There is a network effect. Imagine if you made a ridesharing app with only one driver. No one would use the app due to high wait times. That's an edge case but it gets the point across: too few drivers and no one will use your app, and if no one uses the app no drivers will enlist in your service.

But drivers aren't locked in to a single service, and there's little to no cost for drivers to be on both Uber and MyStartup, so the network effect is diminshed.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#69

Post by bagacrap »

docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Even if you invest purely cynically you might reasonably believe that Uber's toxic culture will eventually catch up with them.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#70

Post by deminature »

Synthetase wrote: post #54
deminature wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you considered you might be glossing over some of the complexity involved in running operations like these?

I am private beta testing an app that does exactly what is described.

It seems like there might be a difference between an app that serves a few hundred people and an app that serves hundreds of millions of people.
Post reply on HN