Earlier quoted context omitted.
We got a point system in The Netherlands. If you get too many points, you lose your license. However it only counts for new drivers. Which doesn't make sense at all, as its elitist towards the older adults.
Until you take a look at statistics on age vs. number of accidents. Young people ( [0] https://www.swov.nl/feiten-cijfers/factsheet/18-tot-en-met-2...
AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
381–390 of 416 posts
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#382Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you're driving a car and someone walks in front of the car you'll slam on the brakes. This is independent of legality. I'd hope that it'd be the case even if laws were passed that explicitly punished braking in such a scenario. Anyway, in the UK, it's illegal to walk down the side of a motorway. But basically anywhere else is free reign for pedestrians. People don't generally walk out in front of (fast moving) car…
When I said "can", I meant by the rules, not the laws of physics. The car is morally obligated to try not to hit anyone no matter what, but that's not what I'm talking about. And the picture I have in mind isn't someone suicidally leaping in front of a car, it's someone taking one step to order the cars to stop. This would be fine if there was a "reasonable stopping rate" clause, but it doesn't sound like there is.
Rest assured, no car driver ever stops in this situation unless the pedestrian is at a zebra crossing.
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#383Earlier quoted context omitted.
I googled this quickly, and I'm seeing the UK has 36 deaths per billion miles driven [1] and USA is 1.7 [2]. Can you cite your sources that the UK isn't disproportionately high? I could be reading the numbers wrong. [1] https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... [2] https://injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/11/4/232
What is being counted? Have I got this right? In the UK it appears they're counting the deaths per billion miles that people walk. In your BMJ article it appears they're counting deaths per billion miles that people drive.
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#384Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you're driving a car and someone walks in front of the car you'll slam on the brakes. This is independent of legality. I'd hope that it'd be the case even if laws were passed that explicitly punished braking in such a scenario. Anyway, in the UK, it's illegal to walk down the side of a motorway. But basically anywhere else is free reign for pedestrians. People don't generally walk out in front of (fast moving) car…
When I said "can", I meant by the rules, not the laws of physics. The car is morally obligated to try not to hit anyone no matter what, but that's not what I'm talking about. And the picture I have in mind isn't someone suicidally leaping in front of a car, it's someone taking one step to order the cars to stop. This would be fine if there was a "reasonable stopping rate" clause, but it doesn't sound like there is.
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#385Earlier quoted context omitted.
Pretty much. The same exists in the UK in all sorts of fields. My preferred strategy is repeated escalation mixed with what I'd call some variant of baby language. "You owe me X, please send me X, your internal processes are broken, please send me X". "No, I don't care about your internal processes, you owe me X, please send me X." "You haven't sent me X yet; can you send me X or do I need to initiate legal action?"…
I’ve always had excellent, and prompt customer service from Amazon. I’m curious to know what kinds of issues have you encountered where you were unhappy with how they dealt with it?
It took almost a month to get a refund whilst Amazon 'investigated'. Yes, it was eventually fixed, but not without a huge amount of 'process says this and that' warbling.
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#386Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Having started to cross they have priority over traffic" - Not true and potentially dangerous misinformation. Jaywalking controls are stupid because: 1. They restrict the freedom of pedestrians. 2. They encourage extra pedestrian crossings, which increases the number of hazards to drivers. 3. They move responsibility for pedestrian safety from pedestrians to drivers. As a Briton, it always feels like living in some…
> "Having started to cross they have priority over traffic" - Not true and potentially dangerous misinformation. It is true at junctions. Rule 170. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/using-the-road-... > 3. Road junctions > 170. Take extra care at junctions. You should [...] > Watch out for pedestrians crossing a road into which you are turning. If they have started to cross they have priority, so give way
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#387Earlier quoted context omitted.
Finland, I believe, scales fines proportionally to your income. Not perfect (the rich can more easily hide their income than the not so rich), but a good start.
That just screws the middle class (~$40k to $150k). The cost of waging legal warfare against the ticket will still be greater than the inflated fine while the wealthy will easily be able to afford the kind of lawyer who can get an overworked traffic court judge and the cop who has to take a day off from fieldwork to agree to more reasonable terms. The solution to fines is to simply get rid of fines and instead use a…
The points system disproportionately advantages the working poor. Speaking from experience, we have a mixed points+fines[1] system in Poland.
A wealthy person can easily weasel his way out of the points by either having a lawyer argue in court, or - especially in case of automated enforcement like speed traps - simply pay a third party (usually poor person who drives little or not at all) to accept the blame & penalty points in his stead by formally admitting to having been driving during the infraction. I've seen many ads for such exchanges.
Since several kind of jobs directly depend on being able to drive, the law customarily provides a way to shed the points in an expedited way. Typically it involves taking part in road safety courses and/or extra examination. You pay, you attend - or not, if you pay a little extra on the side - and your points get cancelled out. This is much more doable for somebody with expendable income and ability to shuffle work schedule around.
Absent such ability to shed or cancel out the penalty points, any working poor or middle class person who depends on ability to drive to earn the keep is under constant threat of loosing the job. Not a good position to negotiate with the employer.
tl;dr: The points system is unfairly burdensome for the working poor due to the system being much influenced by money. All the points do is to hide away the fact that money gets shit done.
--
[1] the fine are fixed, and rather mild from middle class' perspective.
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#388Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's quite the brush you're painting with there. Is the primary motivation behind fining the same everywhere?
If the primary motivation anywhere was to alter driver behaviour, a points based penalty system is all it would take. Monetary fines in traffic infringements are entirely for revenue. Anecdote time: a friend from one of the nation's major universities was involved in a road authority funded study to evaluate the safety impact of newly installed speed cameras at several intersections. They found there was none. Said r…
This distinction is made very clear, for example in a parliament answer by the justice minister: "...it is clear that the purpose of fines is not to increase the revenue of police departments but first and foremost to deter traffic violations and increase traffic safety."
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#389Earlier quoted context omitted.
I googled this quickly, and I'm seeing the UK has 36 deaths per billion miles driven [1] and USA is 1.7 [2]. Can you cite your sources that the UK isn't disproportionately high? I could be reading the numbers wrong. [1] https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... [2] https://injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/11/4/232
What is being counted? Have I got this right? In the UK it appears they're counting the deaths per billion miles that people walk. In your BMJ article it appears they're counting deaths per billion miles that people drive.
Pedestrian deaths per billion miles that people drive seems an odd choice of measure.
Re: AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking
#390Earlier quoted context omitted.
"Having started to cross they have priority over traffic" - Not true and potentially dangerous misinformation. Jaywalking controls are stupid because: 1. They restrict the freedom of pedestrians. 2. They encourage extra pedestrian crossings, which increases the number of hazards to drivers. 3. They move responsibility for pedestrian safety from pedestrians to drivers. As a Briton, it always feels like living in some…
> "Having started to cross they have priority over traffic" - Not true and potentially dangerous misinformation. It is true at junctions. Rule 170. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway-code/using-the-road-... > 3. Road junctions > 170. Take extra care at junctions. You should [...] > Watch out for pedestrians crossing a road into which you are turning. If they have started to cross they have priority, so give way
The onus is on both to take adequate care, and on drivers to stop in time. The presumption of fault is on the driver. Which is not the same as saying pedestrians have free reign to leap into the path of oncoming vehicles, anywhere they like, expecting traffic to stop on a sixpence. Even though that sometimes seems the done thing in London. After all, pedestrians are expected to only cross when it's safe to do so.
So I'm not quite sure what the GP is getting at, except it's often unwise trying to provide a few sentence summary of anything lengthy on HN. :)