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Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

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Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#161

Post by mikeash »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #96
fipple wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LOL. There are tons of educated people who move to Texas. Ever heard of Texas Instruments?

Everyone's heard of Texas Instruments, but the products that make them famous aren't exactly an advertisement for attracting skilled staff. A TI calculator is less than $1 worth of functionality, $100 of "you can use this on standardized tests without being considered a cheater", and $50 of brand recognition. The whole selling point of the product is that it's just as bad now as it was 25 years ago.

That’s like saying GE can’t atteact skilled staff because people only know them for their light bulbs. The sort of people that TI needs to attract will know that they are far more than just old-fashioned calculators.

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#162

Post by thebradbain »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #92
bradchris wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fort Worth is the largest non-Democratic city in all of the US, yes, but if you also look at every election you can see it too is turning bluer and bluer. Also, the government race is not a good indicator. Lupe Valdez has made mistake after mistake in her campaign — I’m liberal, and even I wasn’t enthusiastic about voting for her. She’s doing so bad that she’s polling less than the percentage of registered Democrats…

> Texas last had a Blue governor in 1994. Texas hasn’t always been red — only for the past two decades — and it won’t stay red forever. California last had a Republican governor in 2011, but people will look at you funny if you try to cite that as evidence that California wasn't dyed-in-the-wool Blue at the time.

That's a fair critique. I think my main point wasn't made clear by my comment: all states – even those we consider as Blue as California or as Red as Texas – won't necessarily stay their current color forever.

To discount any state as unchanging is doing a disservice to all US Citizens: public opinion changes, demographics change, politics change, and people change.

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#164

Post by mikeash »

ghobs91 wrote: post #154

My money's on DC area and NYC area. DC for the gov contracts, NYC for the talent pool (Columbia, Cornell Tech, and NYU) and transit network.

That would also make it very convenient to travel between the two, since DC and NYC are so well connected. Dozens of planes and trains every day (including what passes for “high speed” trains in this country) and it’s reasonable to drive too.

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#165

Post by saghm »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #92
bradchris wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fort Worth is the largest non-Democratic city in all of the US, yes, but if you also look at every election you can see it too is turning bluer and bluer. Also, the government race is not a good indicator. Lupe Valdez has made mistake after mistake in her campaign — I’m liberal, and even I wasn’t enthusiastic about voting for her. She’s doing so bad that she’s polling less than the percentage of registered Democrats…

> Texas last had a Blue governor in 1994. Texas hasn’t always been red — only for the past two decades — and it won’t stay red forever. California last had a Republican governor in 2011, but people will look at you funny if you try to cite that as evidence that California wasn't dyed-in-the-wool Blue at the time.

Similarly, Massachusetts currently has a Republican governor, and it's certainly not a red state

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#166

Post by dragonwriter »

thebradbain wrote: post #162
thaumasiotes wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Texas last had a Blue governor in 1994. Texas hasn’t always been red — only for the past two decades — and it won’t stay red forever. California last had a Republican governor in 2011, but people will look at you funny if you try to cite that as evidence that California wasn't dyed-in-the-wool Blue at the time.

That's a fair critique. I think my main point wasn't made clear by my comment: all states – even those we consider as Blue as California or as Red as Texas – won't necessarily stay their current color forever. To discount any state as unchanging is doing a disservice to all US Citizens: public opinion changes, demographics change, politics change, and people change.

Just to illustrate that point, California was a Republican presidential stronghold up through 20 (EDIT: typo, 30) years ago; they won the state in every Presidential election through that year except 1964 starting with 1952.

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#167

Post by thebradbain »

ilikehurdles wrote: post #77
adventured wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd place that bet on Northern Virginia as guaranteed and Chicago, Atlanta or Dallas as the other most plausible, with Toronto being a slight possibility since they're going with two. Colorado is nice, but it's nothing compared to the Texas population and economic boom. 28m people in Texas, versus 5m in Colorado. Texas is also building high-speed rail, which will end up linking all of their major cities, an immense b…

I agree with some of your other points... however > Texas is also building high-speed rail, which will end up linking all of their major cities, an immense bonus. Denver already has light rail connecting the airport, Boulder, and Golden as well as other metro areas, as well as amtrak, shuttles, and other public transport to the mountain regions for skiing and other recreation. It's also among the most bike-friendly c…

I've copy and pasted this comment from an earlier comment I made, but I really do think you have the wrong preconception of Dallas.

The writing is on the wall — Texas will turn blue sooner than later.

Dallas is a liberal stronghold in Texas, and in absolute numbers turns out more for Democrats than any other city in the state, including Austin (percentage-wise Austin wins by +5%, I believe). Unlike Austin, which is gerrymandered in the state legislature, every single state/county/city official in Dallas is a Democrat.

Dallas is also a gay rights stronghold, representing the only county and city in Texas, again including Austin, with non-discrimination clauses in employment and housing for LGBTQ+ individuals.

Furthermore— Texas is considering bi-partisan legislation to legalize weed. Dallas has already decriminalized it, and the State, while backwards in other regards, hasn’t indicated it will force Dallas to back down on that measure. Dallas also has stricter gun laws than the state of Texas. Dallas, unlike Austin, actually has the political capital to push back on state laws, because Dallas isn't gerrymandered nor represented by 4 Republicans like Austin is.

Texas has a long way to go, but I think if you would step in Dallas you would learn to leave your preconceived notions of it at the door.

I believe an HQ2 would speed up Texas’ change.

---

As far as public transit goes, I'm sorry, but DART rail blows Denver out of the water. I'm personally familiar with both systems, and Dallas also has the funds and political capital to keep expanding. In addition to an already extensive LRT network, we have a streetcar network with 2 lines (soon to be 3), we're building a second subway Downtown to double system throughput, we've started construction on another 26 mile line to the airport (we already have 2), and construction on the high speed rail from downtown Houston to downtown Dallas starts in February.

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#168

Post by kodablah »

hcg wrote: post #100
cronix wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't just about all big corporations with some "weight" behind them do this though? A company employing tens of thousands floats the idea that they might leave the city/state due to some new proposed corporate tax legislation or something, and then the city/state exempts them from the increases to get them to stay since they're such a "big employer?" Isn't this just "negotiating from a position of strength?" This ha…

Yeah, but just because this happens doesn't mean we shouldn't be upset about it. This is companies strongarming governments into giving them tax breaks. It's robbing society to enrich a few people at the top. Amazon is following the Boeing example. I fully expect Washington state to give away massive amounts of money the same way they did before.

I admit not being very upset about it. How are they strongarming governments? A government says no and everyone moves on. Or are you saying communities can't get businesses without this strongarming? I don't believe that. I recognize the art of both sides shopping for the best deal for themselves, and with how many of these governments operate against their companies, it's definitely bidirectional. The leverage does seem to be tipped in favor of the largest governments and largest companies, but the general practice seems reasonable.

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#169

Post by why_only_15 »

TomMarius wrote: post #140
Kephael wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only HQ is where the CEO sits.

What if the CEO has a standing desk? Just kidding. What about completely remote companies, or companies where the CEO is remote?

How many companies exist where the CEO is remote? If you're being hired for that important of a job, you're almost certainly willing to move.

Re: Amazon Plans to Split HQ2 Evenly Between Two Cities

#170

Post by epicureanideal »

throwaway427 wrote: post #22
thebradbain wrote: post #8

I’m biased, but I’ve had a feeling in the beginning it was always going to be Dallas in some capacity: 1. DC area may have three potential cities, but Texas is the only other region that has two cities being considered 2. DFW airport is one of the US’s busiest airports, and American Airlines is headquartered there, so you can get a direct flight to anywhere in the country in 3 hours tops. Amazon already has multiple…

> Public transit, continued investment, world class museums, and honestly a pretty hip city with a lot of activity in the center, not unlike Seattle. Also lots of millennials moving there for its low cost of living and ample jobs. Minus museums, this could be said of plenty of other cities that are in places with less wacky politics. Museums don't mean a thing. Low cost of living as a requirement means a relative low…

I haven't heard about any specific issues with Texas politics, versus just regular red-state politics. Is there some specific action being taken against women in Texas that I'm not aware of? (Genuine question, not snark.)
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