"A clear, uniform, globally inclusive process for reporting sexual misconduct safely and anonymously " Can anyone help me understand the rationale behind the anonymous part, with respect to due process and how the framework for anonymous accusations can be abused by bad actors? Edit - I have a question about the anonymous nature of reporting to HR, with respect to due process for the accuser and accused, maybe some o…
Google staff walk out over women's treatment
331–340 of 471 posts
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#332Earlier quoted context omitted.
I would argue that allowing the police to fire individuals from companies would be an egregious violation of human rights on par with disallowing free speech.
Do you think that the average HR department would do a better job at it, and if so why? What would the optimal system be when we want punishment for crimes when the police drops it because there isn't enough proof.
But beyond that, I'm curious why you think the police are the gold standard for handling all of society's disputes? Again, let's ignore that the people and groups who constitute the "police" vary significantly depending on jurisdiction; and also, of course, that the police do not make the ultimate decision to press and pursue charges (that would be the prosecutor's office). The police have the power of government authority and protection behind their decisions and actions, but that is orthogonal to whether they are trained and equipped to come to the right and/or optimal decision.
It's no different than a company hiring private guards for security -- guards who are not only willing to do, well, guard duty, but also are familiar with the company's culture and regulations etc, and are (we would hope) specifically and better-trained for the attack vectors that the company faces. It would be absurd to argue, "Well, that company must not have real security threats if they didn't contract with the police to guard their workplaces"
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#333Earlier quoted context omitted.
Time magazine, which doesn't exactly seem to be a bastion of conservatism, had an article about this http://time.com/3222543/wage-pay-gap-myth-feminism/ , which had more hard-facts than anyone else I've seen, but the conclusion was that most of the claims made by the wage gap supporters are cherrypicked and false. Although, if Google specifically has a problem with it, I'd definitely be willing to listen. If they are…
> Time magazine, which doesn't exactly seem to be a bastion of conservatism Although Christina Hoff Sommers does have a noticeable bias/axe to grind since she's pretty anti-feminism and considers there to be a "war against boys". Also she works for the AEI which is a conservative think tank.
This strikes me as "poisoning the well."
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#334"A clear, uniform, globally inclusive process for reporting sexual misconduct safely and anonymously " Can anyone help me understand the rationale behind the anonymous part, with respect to due process and how the framework for anonymous accusations can be abused by bad actors? Edit - I have a question about the anonymous nature of reporting to HR, with respect to due process for the accuser and accused, maybe some o…
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#335"A clear, uniform, globally inclusive process for reporting sexual misconduct safely and anonymously " Can anyone help me understand the rationale behind the anonymous part, with respect to due process and how the framework for anonymous accusations can be abused by bad actors? Edit - I have a question about the anonymous nature of reporting to HR, with respect to due process for the accuser and accused, maybe some o…
In general, 21% of workers who report misconduct suffer from retribution (source: National Business Ethics Survey).
An estimated 75% of workplace harassment victims experience retaliation when they speak up (source: US Equal Employment Opportunity Commission government agency).
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#336Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#337I don't understand this at all. Google chief executive Sundar Pichai has told staff he supports their right to take the action. "I understand the anger and disappointment that many of you feel," he said in an all-staff email. "I feel it as well, and I am fully committed to making progress on an issue that has persisted for far too long in our society… and, yes, here at Google, too." If someone at the top is sincerely…
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#338"A clear, uniform, globally inclusive process for reporting sexual misconduct safely and anonymously " Can anyone help me understand the rationale behind the anonymous part, with respect to due process and how the framework for anonymous accusations can be abused by bad actors? Edit - I have a question about the anonymous nature of reporting to HR, with respect to due process for the accuser and accused, maybe some o…
Harassment is rarely the case of a single incident. Instead, people who harass other usually have a long history of harassing lots of people.
An anonymous complaint could be used not to determine guilt, but instead to trigger an investigation.
And if the person is guilty, then the investigation will almost certainly have a very easy time finding somebody, likely many, who will go on record with their incident of harassment.
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#339"A clear, uniform, globally inclusive process for reporting sexual misconduct safely and anonymously " Can anyone help me understand the rationale behind the anonymous part, with respect to due process and how the framework for anonymous accusations can be abused by bad actors? Edit - I have a question about the anonymous nature of reporting to HR, with respect to due process for the accuser and accused, maybe some o…
Total anonymity for accusers is indeed a concerning policy, but partial anonymity (i.e. from one's own team) isn't unreasonable. It ought to be possible to properly investigate misconduct allegations while minimizing the potential for gossip and recriminations.
Re: Google staff walk out over women's treatment
#340Earlier quoted context omitted.
> What are these people personally doing to ensure that they are respecting women, creating the right kind of social climate at work, etc? Part of the reason to go to the walkout was to find out what to do. People didn't just stand there doing nothing. They listened to women speak about their experiences and ask for specific, concrete actions from attendees that would lead to less sexual harassment, bias, and associa…
Okay, cool. Is there some reason this piece couldn't be done after hours? (Or, alternately) Is there some reason this couldn't be framed as "We are taking time off to discuss this amongst ourselves and better understand the problem space" without it being framed as a walk-out with a flyer left on the desk filled with their opinion? Do these things have to go hand in hand?