I see articles like this and they always seem to overlook the solution: hire remotely. Oh sure, it isn't what they want and yes it introduces complexity they might not want, but it is the answer. People want to live where they want to live. Some might be lured by more money. Some will recognize that there are clusters of jobs in certain urban areas and be unwilling to move to other locations as a result. Not in one of those prime tech clusters? Just accept that you need to hire where the people are, not where you want them to be. Furthermore, there's an irony of tech firms making money over the internet, but believing all their staff must be physically located together.
Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
51–60 of 84 posts
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#52Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, the BBC has an anti-Brexit agenda.
That’s a ludicrous statement. Do you have any evidence whatsoever to back it up?
Evidence you'd accept, probably not, although you can simply observe the kinds of stories they choose to promote and arrive at a reasonable conclusion.
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#53I am continually amazed at the cynical attempt by hiring managers to try to pretend that the laws of supply and demand shouldn't apply to non-exec level staff. If you can't hire the people you want for what you're offering that should be a signal to pay more, not to whine that you can't force your idea of a reasonable wage on others.
Among the insightful humorous essays of C. Northcote Parkinson (cf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law ) there's one about wording job ads that says:
"Only a little thought is needed to convince us that the perfect advertisement would attract only one reply and that from the right person."
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#54I am continually amazed at the cynical attempt by hiring managers to try to pretend that the laws of supply and demand shouldn't apply to non-exec level staff. If you can't hire the people you want for what you're offering that should be a signal to pay more, not to whine that you can't force your idea of a reasonable wage on others.
So while there is validity to this, my experience hiring staff is that there is genuinely a lack of skilled tech workers in the UK, especially at senior levels - it’s not just down to salary requirements.
Sure - as demand goes up and supply is constrained, salaries have to rise. But it’s more complex than that - first, salary increases don’t magically increase supply. There’s a long lag time between salary rises and increased supply. On top of that, there’s a particular dearth of senior engineers. It’s easier to recruit people with less experience, and there’s nothing wrong with doing that and training them up - but this in itself takes quite a lot of investment and can be difficult in a small team. And third, the UK’s shitty immigration process and ongoing Brexit catastrophe make it more difficult to recruit developers from other countries.
At some point, it becomes economically infeasible to run a functioning business as the staff you need become more expensive to hire. It’s good for people in that market, but it can also make it difficult to run a sustainable small business, and it’s okay to call attention to that. Like most things, it’s a bit of a balancing act.
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#55Engineers willing to move for their job would normally move to silicon valley and get offered $150k, and much lower taxes.
Even at £100k (and ~45% tax!), you're only going to get people who either already live in Cardiff, or are happy to relocate to Wales, but not to relocate to the USA (not all that many people).
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
That’s a ludicrous statement. Do you have any evidence whatsoever to back it up?
Evidence you'd accept, probably not, although you can simply observe the kinds of stories they choose to promote and arrive at a reasonable conclusion.
In other words, no.
Since the BBC is routinely and equally criticised for being both pro- and anti-Brexit, it’s reasonable to assume that it’s more likely to be neither.
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#57In the article they say they are offering London salaries. Fine. But Cardiff is not the same as London ! London is huge comapred to Cardiff. Cardiff has about 500,000 people in its urban area compared to 10,000,000 in London, and Cardiff is about 30 square miles compared to almost 700 square miles for London [1]. As such London just has a lot more going on - theatre, museums, nightlife, restaurants, sports, shopping,…
You're projecting your own perception onto others. Let me raise a counterpoint, the cost of living in Cardiff is vastly less than the, frankly, over inflated prices in London. I'm going to reuse your tone here - who would give up Cardiff to go to London to get the same Salary but pay twice as much for rent? I'd raise another point as well - you're assuming people prefer the art and culture scene in London in comparis…
You're totally correct - its not for everyone (just like Cardiff is not for everyone). London is a big city and comes with big city problems.
However, I'd still argue that their offer is clearly not competitive by matching London salaries since they are not getting applicants.
For what it is worth, in my personal opinion if you are renting on 100K a year, you're Doing It Wrong. I appreciate some people value the flexibility of renting though. Saving up for a mortgage deposit with £100K a year salary and equity grants etc should be no problems, and mortgage repayments are usually either equal or substantially lower than rental rates for equivalent properties. Even in London, a commute of just 25 minutes from central London [2] you can buy a one bed flat for 250-300K which is very affordable on a 100K a year salary. [1]
1 - https://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/find.html?loca...
2 - https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Finchley+Central+Station/Tra...
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#58Can't get staff? What a shame. Would you consider starting some kind of training policy?
Training? These days? Not gonna happen.
If it does, it is in elite organizations under the wing of highly principled bosses who are able shield their staff from project-management and organization-wide performance-metrics bullshit.
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#59I am continually amazed at the cynical attempt by hiring managers to try to pretend that the laws of supply and demand shouldn't apply to non-exec level staff. If you can't hire the people you want for what you're offering that should be a signal to pay more, not to whine that you can't force your idea of a reasonable wage on others.
True. On the other hand, there are hard limits to what companies can afford to pay their employees. Related to the same supply and demand laws.
I think your following the logic of the minimum wage laws. In this case however the wages are not fixed but purely determined by the market. Given that markets are optimizers of capital allocation, if a company cannot be profitable at the current values (relating to input and output) then it should not exist.
Re: Cardiff tech firm: 'We'll pay £100k, but can't get staff'
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
Although your chances of dying in Cardiff are probably less than in Tel Aviv.
I looked that up back in the day when I had to go to Tel Aviv for work during the time of the suicide bombings (2004/2005): The chance of dying a violent death in Israel is much lower than in the US. Cardiff is probably lower than the average of the US, of course. And Tel Aviv may be higher than the average of Israel. But AFAIK, suicide bombing on regular civilian places inside Israel hasn’t been a thing for quite a…
Fair point. I'd argue it is still a tinderbox and with current middle East political situation it could easily find itself without immediate allies (or at least people who don't want to immediately destroy them). If for example the house of Saud fell, it is unlikely to be replaced by anything that would be as friendly toward the US, and by extension Israel, as the House of Saud currently is.