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Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

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Re: Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

#381

Post by Kaveren »

Fnoord wrote: post #359
Kaveren wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like a privileged position to argue that there's no downside to people having smartphones. Many people are unable to regularly access decent laptops or desktops. Internet access is essential. The Internet lets you communicate with friends and family, access a massive trove of knowledge quickly (freeing up education), discuss current events, and all manner of other things. Even personally as a well to do Amer…

Hello FOMO. I grew up in a world where I had to pay by the minute to access the internet or use a phone. I did not have access to a computer 24/7. Not having/using/carrying a smartphone is a conscious decision one can make with positive and negative aspects. Bruce Schneier points that out in his book Data and Goliath.

Not having a smartphone is much easier to do when you have regular access to a decent laptop or desktop. Many people in developing countries do not.

There is nothing "FOMO" about Internet access, it is extremely important. The world changed a lot from where we were 30 years ago.

The advantages of having a computer you can bring with you (be that a laptop, tablet, or phone) are enormous.

This is why I consider implying that billions of people having smartphones is a bad thing to be an extremely privileged position to take.

Re: Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

#382

Post by bunnycorn »

nemo846 wrote: post #21
thefounder wrote: post #14

Well Apple can start by making Siri work locally/without internet and then I believe their stance.

If they could I believe they would. They rather not be reliant on whoever is providing their speak recognition.

> They rather not be reliant on whoever is providing their speak recognition.

Apple has their own speech recognition tech.

Re: Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

#385

Post by aembleton »

stephenr wrote: post #224
ThomPete wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear what you are saying and agree in the sense that a lot of this is being misused by people who want to take advantage of what they know about you/us in whatever shape or form they can get the data to get away with. Chinas use of data is definitely not the way to go. However, I would also caution against the push for almost complete privacy as that IMO leaves out a number of potential advantages from systems havi…

Name an advantage to google knowing what colour underwear you bought last Thursday at 3pm from an eBay seller called “thrusty jack”? Siri/iOS/macOS/etc are proof that “smart” services can be done on-device and/or without identifying information and still be useful. Google does it all server side because it’s the cash cow their entire business is built on, not because it’s the only way to do it.

If they are getting the data from Gmail, then it is useful for the heuristics in understanding what is and what is not spam.

AFAIK, ebay don't use GA although most of the web do. GA is I'm sure largely to help with their advertising business. That is useful because it gives website owners (who choose to use it) analytics.

Re: Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

#386

Post by blihp »

burtonator wrote: post #258

I'd like to think I'm one of the good guys here. I was one of the inventors of RSS and Atom and worked to push open content and social media. I started a social data search platform named Datastreamer ( http://www.datastreamer.io/ ) which is basically a petabyte-scale content indexing engine. We provide API feeds to search engines and social media analytics companies needing bulk data but don't want to have to build…

Despite your intentions, I don't think it's possible for you to be one of the good guys. The mass collection and aggregation of the data in the first place is the problem, not merely a few bad actors downstream.

Re: Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

#387

Post by module0000 »

da_chicken wrote: post #308
burtonator wrote: post #258

I'd like to think I'm one of the good guys here. I was one of the inventors of RSS and Atom and worked to push open content and social media. I started a social data search platform named Datastreamer ( http://www.datastreamer.io/ ) which is basically a petabyte-scale content indexing engine. We provide API feeds to search engines and social media analytics companies needing bulk data but don't want to have to build…

And people wonder why I've argued that, at some point, IT needs to be a certified and regulated profession like lawyers, doctors, engineers, nurses, pilots, accountants, electricians, plumbers, teachers, etc. If the future is going to be built using software and data, it's probably going to be essential that the general public have some agency -- public or private -- to safeguard the public interest. It takes years o…

>> anybody off the street can build an application

No they can't. The closest is they can steal(copy/paste) portions of other people's applications, change some text, and attempt to take credit for them.

Also, we do have agency(private) that you suggested. Developer certification programs exist for nearly every language and platform. They aren't very popular. Red Hat will certify you as a java developer for JBoss, Oracle will certify you as a java developer as well. If you can't write code, but still want to feel geeky and have a career as a waiter, you can go get certified as an "ethical hacker" too.

There is no shortage of agency - employers and consumers simply do not care, and by that, I mean they do not want to pay(higher prices) for it.

PS: You can go be an amateur electrician or plumber today, without breaking any laws. However, if you'd like to touch private/public power or water/waste infrastructure, then you need endorsement. It's not illegal for you to hire me(a total amateur at those 2 trades) to both wire and plumb the new house you are building. The awkward moment will be when the water and power company refuse to connect your house, because the work I did was not the work of a licensed electrician or plumber. I understand the spirit of your analogy, but it doesn't translate as well with IT. For that analogy to work, then private/public internet infrastructure would have to refuse to inter-operate with your software if you didn't meet their licensing/certification standard.

Re: Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

#388

Post by RestlessMind »

jimbokun wrote: post #362
tinco wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps it is cynicism, but I'm pretty sure this is just Apple exploiting a competitive edge, and does not necessarily reflect his own opinion, he is speaking to benefit the company. Of course, it's very nice that Apple made the decision to pick this edge, but they did it because they could not compete with Google on web services. So now they're publicly speaking to try and take the sting out of Google's edge. And th…

Apple is also the only major computing player that doesn't make its revenue primarily off of mining and exploiting user data. Maybe Microsoft, too? Certainly the rest of FAANG have huge financial temptations to misuse their data. So Apple is the one big technology player whose interests are most closely aligned with the consumer in terms of supporting data privacy.

Amazon, fwiw, has giant revenue streams (AWS, retail) that they can pile on the privacy bandwagon and attack Google / Facebook / rest of the shitty adtech. In fact, it would be great if Apple, Microsoft, Amazon, Mozilla et al all combine their forces and propose strong privacy friendly regulations.

Re: Tim Cook makes blistering attack on the “data industrial complex”

#390

Post by s3r3nity »

reacharavindh wrote: post #376

Disclaimer: I use Apple products, and trust them slightly more than anything Google/FaceBook/startups because they don't have a business front selling my data to advertisement companies or 3rd party miners(as much as I know of). But, I'm baffled by this PR as if they are the privacy messiah. Didn't they just sellout their Chinese users icloud data to the Chinese government? Yeah. "It's the law, and Apple has to obey…

I struggle with Apple's China situation as well, but the more I turn it over in my head, the more I think it's that Tim is pulled between two parties:

1) His team + Apple Directors that I firmly believe, both in words AND in their action, are strong proponents of privacy of the user

2) The Apple Board + Sharedholders that would revolt if the privacy principles from (1) prevented access to a market of ~1.4 billion people, and potentially gave a competitor like Huawei a further leg up.

In this scenario, I don't see it as "grand-standing," but more of a necessary public act that US should move more in the policy direction of the EU, in spite of steep lobbying from most of the Valley / FANG group that would benefit from less-strict privacy regulations.

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