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Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

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Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#271

Post by d_runs_far »

martin1b wrote: post #30
Slimbo wrote: post #10

Depending on their age, for young kids best results I've had are Pi's (or old/cheap pc's) that boot straight into scratch. Far better results than an intimidating command prompt. https://scratch.mit.edu/ Alternatively Pi's (or old/cheap pc's) that boot straight into Minecraft Eduction Edition: https://education.minecraft.net This has paths for the very young in minecraft itself to older kids using ide's.

I second this. My kids love scratch. It shows them event driven programming with quick returns. The can also share their apps and download others so they can download and modify.

How old are the kids? Mine is just turning 5, and I've been looking at this as an option, but as many have said, I don't want to feel like I'm 'forcing' the tech learning on him.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#273

Post by int_19h »

potta_coffee wrote: post #3

The closest thing I've found to this is Pico-8: not a computer, a piece of software, but it's very cool. It has a simple text editor for writing Lua code, a simple sprite editor, and a simple sound editor, all for creating games. It's a nice little sandbox for playing with code and creating things. https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php

There actually was a computer that ran PICO-8 out of the box, too:

https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2016/7/19/12227806/p...

Unfortunately, the company has shut down, and these aren't made anymore. But it looks like they can still be found on eBay:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pocket-C-H-I-P-sealed-portable-hand...

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#274

Post by normalhuman »

teddyh wrote: post #79
normalhuman wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I too grew up with a "power on to basic" computer, in my case the ZX Spectrum. I don't think that people that did not have that experience at that age can truly get it. I was able to create graphics and play sounds with a very simple language. The text editor, the graphical display, the "OS", it was all the same thing. The manual taught you how to program in BASIC. It was an amazing tool of creativity and intellectua…

Your personal experience is not the only correct one. I assure you that the people coming before you, making their own computers out of chips and resistors with a soldering iron, would say the same thing about you. And people who grew up with Windows 98 say the same thing about people only exposed to iOS and Android, and so on.

I think you misunderstand me. You are talking about computers and technology, I am talking about crayons, paint, musical instruments... Things that you can immediately use to create without restrictions. There was a small window of time when computers offered that for kids. There is no reasons why this could not be achieved with modern technology, but somehow our current culture prevents it. I'm sure it will be reinvented one day.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#275

Post by foobarian »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #93
blihp wrote: post #81

For those of us who grew up in the 8-bit era, this has a lot of appeal since that's how we got engaged. But for most kids today, is this sort of ab initio approach really the right way to go about it? Based on my experience with a few different types of kids/personalities, I'm skeptical. Dropping them into the command line / IDE of any language / environment is likely to leave them both unimpressed and lost. Neither…

Kids have it too easy today, they don't have to work very hard to get decent computing experiences, and its not like they have to do any programming at all to have fun. It is also super easy to get addicted to just consuming all the time. It is quite depressing. My kid is still a toddler, but I think I might put a stripped down CLI-only computer in his room when he reaches 5 so he can at least play with it if he want…

I've been thinking along those lines, with some external GPIO pins hooked up to toys and simple commands to control them. So the kid could type "ON 4" and the pin labeled 4 hooked up to a light would turn it on. Or "VOLUME 3" to set the volume of the sound output. File system commands like LS, CD, and PLAY to play a music file to sound out. Maybe more commands that control RC channels where you have lots of flexibility on what you put on the other end.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#276

Post by nyjah »

JacobJans wrote: post #192
nyjah wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know I am lucky to have this setup, but I keep 2 laptops and 2 tower computers or 4 separate computers. 1 for biz, 1 for downloading and email, 1pc for gaming, and 1 for activities best kept in private browsing..

Very interesting. What kind of software do you have on the computers? Is there anything, beyond the physical separation, that supports the purpose of each device? (Maybe something as simple as physical location, color, a "sticker", or something else altogether.)

Only software on the machines are strictly for what I am using them for. I have a router with a harddrive if I do download something and want to put it on another machine, but I don't remote desktop into them or anything. Each computer is on a separate desk, own monitor and mouse and keyboard. I just like it separate and not complicated. Keeps work stuff super focused and clean, for me. I could network them more if I wanted to, but gets the job done.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#277

Post by leo_song »

BASIC and any other toy platform are a bad ways of starting programming and primary school kids do speak in assembly code. Throw some microcontrollers, LEDs and motors to them, they will be happy. Boards like Arduino may be a good option.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#278

Post by jriot »

htor wrote: post #265
drngdds wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really like the idea of ditching my smartphone for a dumbphone, but giving up Google Maps would be rough. Knowing the fastest way to get from point A to point B (including public transportation!) is genuinely really useful.

do it and re-discover the art of getting lost!

And how to navigate a city on your own.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#279

Post by flukus »

normalhuman wrote: post #67
swiley wrote: post #35

Just give them a computer running linux without going all the way to runlevel 5. Bash is fairly expressive and gets you the basics of programming, and then you can easily use a more complex language fairly easily and have all the abstractions from bash that lets you build fairly useful programs without having to build complex UIs.

I too grew up with a "power on to basic" computer, in my case the ZX Spectrum. I don't think that people that did not have that experience at that age can truly get it. I was able to create graphics and play sounds with a very simple language. The text editor, the graphical display, the "OS", it was all the same thing. The manual taught you how to program in BASIC. It was an amazing tool of creativity and intellectua…

There's shell curses (https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/aix/library/au-shellcurse...) that is very similar to graphics programming on those machines, minus the sprites. You can even do opengl programming: https://github.com/nrdvana/CmdlineGL .

There are some python shells around (the developer of one posts here) that might make for a better experience than bash though scripts though, either way they'll learn some real world tools.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#280

Post by progval »

Despite being 25yo, this is how I started programming too. My "computer" was a TI-80 calculator I had laying around. It can be programmed in a simple variant Basic: 26 variables, 6 arrays, but also plotting capabilities.

You can probably still find such a calculator, like the TI-82 family which is being revived. Just avoid the TI-Nspire which looks fancy but is hard to program.

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