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H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

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Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#111

Post by phakding »

fjsolwmv wrote: post #47
paxy wrote: post #41

Sounds accurate. There is no realistic path to citizenship or even permanent residency in the USA for highly skilled immigrants from India. While the high salaries and quality of life are attractive for someone straight out of college, you quickly realize that this isn't the place to be if you want to buy a house, start a family, or make any other major life decision when you could be asked to pack up and leave tomor…

That sounds great. Come to USA after college, make a million dollars in a few years, move back home, get married, and build the Indian economy. You don't want a country where every who has the ability will leave.

> That sounds great. Come to USA after college, make a million dollars in a few years, move back home, get married, and build the Indian economy

LOL. Your comment doesn't even pass smell taste. How many people working as developers will make million dollars in few years after paying payroll taxes? Federal, state, social security, medicare on top of paying for housing, car insurance, health insurance, renter/house owner's insurance, trips back to homeland etc etc. Forget about fun and entertainment, or clothes, shoes, phones, computers, internet etc. Even with extreme level of penny pinching, 40% rate of saving is almost unachievable.

Now assuming every single immigrant that comes here after college makes $150 right off the bat, that $60K in bank every year. At that rate, to save million dollars, one would need 16.66 years. That too assuming there are no incidentals that become money pits.

Good luck getting married at almost 40 or getting uprooted and having to adjust to the different work environment or progress in the industry without any contacts. It's not all puppys and rainbows.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#112

Post by drpgq »

refurb wrote: post #23
otalp wrote: post #16

I suppose my comments from yesterdays thread about "Cheap places to live with a good intellectual atmosphere" is relevant: I did the math for Toronto(which is more expensive than Montreal, and about the same as Vancouver). For a typical software engineer, taxes take away 25% of gross pay in Ontario while it's over 30% in California and New York. Cost of living is much less(by 30-40% if you rent) in Toronto compared t…

data, groceries and restaurants are 20% cheaper(adjusted for currency) Why would you adjust for currency when you're paid in Canadian dollars?

What are they referring to as data? Cell costs are pretty expensive in Canada for what you get.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#113

Post by otalp »

pmalynin wrote: post #99
otalp wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone in the big 4 I can tell you 200k TC in SV is nowhere near 200k annually starting out. That would involve 70-80k in RSU that vest over 4 years, and in companies like Amazon(whose stock has been going up like crazy) that is divested 5%, 15%, 40% and 40% annually, so you get the bulk of it only later on.\ It wasn't long ago that Google was offering 100k base in the valley(where If you want to maximise disposa…

Thanks for you input. But I am aware of the breakdown of the compensation packages and I stand behind my statement having just accepted a new grad role at FAANG. 70-80k RSUs are on the lower end. For example standard Facebook offers are 140 base, 100k signing, 150 stock / 4y. I will be living with my partner and we calculated that with an apartment of 3-4k a month will be still saving at least tens of thousands of do…

Oh yeah, I agree that a FAANG job(Facebook is usually the highest TC) in the valley is way better value then staying in Canada. But of course the average person doesn't get close to that much. On _average_ software engineers are better off in Seattle than in the valley, and if their annual comp is less than 140k(average entry level salary is 100k in San Fran), they should consider alternatives that look like they pay less.

Over the last 4 years accounting for stock rises, CoL and lower taxes, Amzn/Microsoft in Seattle would have paid out quite a bit more than FAANG in the valley.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#114

Post by docker_up »

jszymborski wrote: post #34
otalp wrote: post #16

I suppose my comments from yesterdays thread about "Cheap places to live with a good intellectual atmosphere" is relevant: I did the math for Toronto(which is more expensive than Montreal, and about the same as Vancouver). For a typical software engineer, taxes take away 25% of gross pay in Ontario while it's over 30% in California and New York. Cost of living is much less(by 30-40% if you rent) in Toronto compared t…

Overall, I agree with your points, but I have some points of contention with some of the analysis. I don't think it's quite fair to include tax if you're not going to include savings for things like health care. Furthermore, Toronto's housing market, while less expensive than Cali/NY, is still insane. I know you acknowledge this in passing, but Montreal's housing market is insanely affordable, and we've a great tech/…

There isn't much savings in terms of health care. In Ontario, if you're working you have to pay a health care tax that is similar to what an employee would pay at a Silicon Valley company. And then the health care is much worse in terms of responsiveness. For example, I have Kaiser, and my Canadians friends are envious at how quickly I get scheduled for procedures. My family and friends have had to wait months for some procedures or tests.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#115

Post by pnw_hazor »

nraynaud wrote: post #72
fjsolwmv wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Green Card has a risk of deportation that citizenship does not. But the current administration is working to make citizenship revocable.

They have a unit for stripping people's citizenship now.

Lying on immigration applications has always been grounds for revocation of citizenship.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#116

Post by GhostVII »

dubya123 wrote: post #79
GhostVII wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like the number of tech people who legitimately worry about their spouse being deported is extremely small. And it's only two years until the next election anyways.

I think that gives little reassurance.

Well your initial point was that people will put up with Canada's cold winters to avoid having their spouse deported. I don't think that is a realistic scenario (and if your spouse is an illegal immigrant, I seriously doubt Canada would let the immigrate).

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#117

Post by mywittyname »

param wrote: post #106
mywittyname wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm genuinely curious who these experts are that claim that the Paris Accord is useless and why they assert such a claim. Seeing as it was put together with the consultation of hundreds of scientist from all over the world who've spent their career studying climate change, I'm guessing the objections come from political experts, not scientific ones.

Just do a google search. Even the UN admits it was a fraud: https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/the-un-admits-...

I wanted to hear directly from you, rather than guess at what you may be referencing.

The argument being made there is that the Paris Accord doesn't go far enough. That doesn't mean that we shouldn't give it our best shot. We have to remember that the Paris Accord is basically the minimum that we should strive for and that we have to keep in mind the politics -- if we push too hard then people may just give up.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#118

Post by b1tr0t »

zeroxfe wrote: post #2

As horrible as it sounds, in this specific respect, the current US administration has been really fantastic for Canada. More and more new grads are choosing to stay in the country and work with local tech companies, and we're experiencing a reverse brain-drain like never before.

From a Canadian viewpoint, the last couple of years of populism has been a bit like discovering your favorite Uncle has a probably lethal opiate addiction.

But, you're going to get to inherit his Corvette.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#119

Post by untog »

User23 wrote: post #89
untog wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't sound great for the individual, though. Standard of life in the US and Canada is higher than in India, and they'll likely want their kids to grow up in better circumstances than they did, if that's possible. Besides, you're not going to make a million dollars in a few years. New grad salaries take a while to turn into experienced developer salaries, and the money you make from 20-30 is unlikely to last you…

Parent's point is that rather than just improving the lives of a few hundred thousand emigrants, it's far more moral to improve the lives of hundreds of millions of Indians and that can't happen if the best and brightest all leave.

Sure, and my counterpoint is that it doesn't make individual sense, so as moral as it may be, few are likely to do it. I'm sympathetic to the idea, I just think these things need to benefit both the individual and the group in order to succeed.

Re: H-1B: As immigration furor roils Silicon Valley, Canada smooths way for techies

#120

Post by param »

mywittyname wrote: post #117
param wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just do a google search. Even the UN admits it was a fraud: https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/the-un-admits-...

I wanted to hear directly from you, rather than guess at what you may be referencing. The argument being made there is that the Paris Accord doesn't go far enough. That doesn't mean that we shouldn't give it our best shot. We have to remember that the Paris Accord is basically the minimum that we should strive for and that we have to keep in mind the politics -- if we push too hard then people may just give up.

Yep, it doesn't go far enough - even if all countries did everything in the accord we wouldn't change anything.

If this was a business setting, a proposal like this would be laughed out of existence. Somehow, when it is a Dem/progressive policy people still take it seriously.

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