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Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

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Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#341

Post by wil421 »

foepys wrote: post #181
RileyJames wrote: post #168

When I upgraded my MacBook Air, I decided to try switching away from Apple. Primarily because the new MBP’s & Air’s were expensive, and all the new feature which made them expensive were things I didn’t want or need. I also wanted to give Linux another shot. I went for a Dell XPS, and while there are things I don’t like (primarily keyboard & trackpad) I’ve got used to them. (Keyboard still shits me). But, when the mo…

For this reason MacBooks aren't really business devices in my opinion. What kind of business is okay with the service Apple provides? You have to send one employee to the Apple Store (if there is even one located near you), maybe get a replacement device, maybe wait for 2 weeks for it to return? This is so much more expensive than buying Dell, HP, Lenovo, etc. with on-site support. On top of that you often get repair…

What do you mean? Large enterprises will surely staff and train their own Mac support staff. I went to my companies walk up support desk in my building for an HP Zbook issue. They had a few Macs taken apart they were fixing.

Apple stores are for consumers like you and me. No large company is going to send an employee there. It’s likely the company has support contract with Apple or a 3rd party.

Beside you can just overnight your laptop to Apple for repairs anyway.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#342

Post by tonyedgecombe »

bigbugbag wrote: post #246
tonyedgecombe wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most customers don't care, they don't care about repairability because modern devices are so reliable, they don't care about upgradeability because they bought the appropriate spec in the first place. Even if it does fail they don't really care about the cost of repair because they bought a premium product and their expectations are set accordingly.

Actually, people do care about repairability more than you think, just look at the growing popularity of repair cafes. To me the issue is that devices are made to appear obsolete, a marketing scheme to boost profit, in a limited time frame and replaced instead of repaired not because they are reliable (for example the lawsuit for prone to breaking keys on recent macbooka[1]). People who care about upgradeability are…

Actually, people do care about repairability more than you think

If they really cared it would be reflected in what they buy.

People who care about upgradeability are people who know better

I see, you are so smart and the rest of us are sheep like idiots for buying products they can't repair.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#343

Post by dep_b »

foepys wrote: post #181
RileyJames wrote: post #168

When I upgraded my MacBook Air, I decided to try switching away from Apple. Primarily because the new MBP’s & Air’s were expensive, and all the new feature which made them expensive were things I didn’t want or need. I also wanted to give Linux another shot. I went for a Dell XPS, and while there are things I don’t like (primarily keyboard & trackpad) I’ve got used to them. (Keyboard still shits me). But, when the mo…

For this reason MacBooks aren't really business devices in my opinion. What kind of business is okay with the service Apple provides? You have to send one employee to the Apple Store (if there is even one located near you), maybe get a replacement device, maybe wait for 2 weeks for it to return? This is so much more expensive than buying Dell, HP, Lenovo, etc. with on-site support. On top of that you often get repair…

Apple Enterprise support programs exist. They're partially ran by IBM and on-site.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#344

Post by dep_b »

consp wrote: post #326
zimpenfish wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whereas when I boot my games box into Windows 10 and it sits there saying "Applying updates" for 45 minutes before rebooting and then thrashing itself into unusability for another 45-60 minutes doing ... something ... I feel like I'm being trolled by MS.

I have the same experience with the force upgrades of OSX (due to xcode). Download is big, require massive 21G of free space, takes ages to update on older MBPs, everything gets more sluggish after the update and crashes more often...

That's just once per year?

Microsoft throws away all of your open work at least every month. NSDocument alone is 25% of the reason I stay with macOS.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#345

Post by linkmotif »

Yetanfou wrote: post #273
praseodym wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The three Apple Stores in The Netherlands so popular that it is impossible to even get an appointment at the Genius Bar. You’ll have to wait for new slots to become available at the end of their 7-day window. When you finally have your appointment after a week there’s usually another 20min+ minute wait before the busy Geniuses can speak to you. Fortunately common iOS repairs (like a display replacement) can often be…

Fortunately there is an easy solution to this conundrum: stop buying products which can only be repaired by "geniuses" in a "licensed shop". The same spiel was tried by car manufacturers where it was quashed by legal requirements to open up for repair by third parties. It is currently being tried by agricultural manufacturers (John Deere being a well-known and not so well-loved example) which try to use firmware lice…

Really appreciate the Bible reference there at the end! Not often you get a bible reference on here, and so topical :)

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#346

Post by r3bl »

wilsonnb3 wrote: post #314
petepete wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But I'm not prepared to have Candy Crush adverts in my Start Menu, which counts Windows out. Additionally, I know I can deactivate them by jumping through a couple of hoops, but that's not the point.

Seems like a strange hill to die on, so to speak. I can’t say I’ve ever noticed the ads in the start menu for more than a few seconds.

That's a few seconds too much.

If it were a free OS where you could upgrade to get rid of the ads, I wouldn't mind it.

But it's not. It's an operating system whose basic price is over $100 and you cannot get rid of them permanently in any way without using third-party software. That piece of shit will never become my choice of the operating system.

The very least they could do is to offer ad-free experience in the Pro version. At this moment, I see no benefit of buying Pro at all.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#347

Post by tomxor »

chiefalchemist wrote: post #318
tobyhinloopen wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope we get a "right to repair" law in EU, where the seller is required by law to provide repairability services next to their regular warranties. That means that, as a seller, you must provide a service to repair (and replacement parts) for "reasonable" prices for anything you sell. For example, if you're selling notebooks, you must be able to provide notebook parts and repair as well for the products you sell. Co…

Maintainability is a feature, so to speak. Another option would be to purchase the product that best fits your needs, including warranty, repair, parts, upgrading, etc. If Brand A decides it's best to not provide Feature X and you __need__ Feature X, then you can decide that Brand A isn't for you. If anything should be legislated it should be publishing the details about warranty coverage, average cost or repair, mos…

> Maintainability is a feature, so to speak.

Yes, but lets be clear, this is not lack of maintainability... this is very clearly _anti_maintainability, there is a big difference.

There is nothing inherent to the hardware design here that makes replacing components impossible, just the addition of this one chip for the single purpose of preventing it.

And it's not surprising, we all know Apple's position on Unofficial or user repair options.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#348

Post by hrktb »

Sharlin wrote: post #329
hrktb wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just in case, it was not meant sarcasticly. Repairs can be done by shipping it to whatever support address they provide. I haven’t done it in years but if your repair shop takes 14 days, it can be signifixantly faster.

The whole point with that 14 business days quote is that they will very likely ship it somewhere outside the country, or at the very least to another city. And if you ship it yourself you most likely have to pay for the shipping from your own pocket.

Not under warranty, Apple provides the shipping both ways.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#349

Post by ehrtt »

rofo1 wrote: post #280
ehrtt wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The RAM is soldered on.

This is incorrect, at least on 9550 / 9560. It's extremely easy to upgrade both of them, just open the back without even fully disassembling the machine.

It is the case for the 13-inch ones.

Re: Apple's Proprietary Software Locks Kill Independent Repair on New MacBook Pros

#350

Post by systemtest »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #217
andr wrote: post #93

The impact of this will be much bigger outside of the US, as most countries outside of North America do not have a single Apple Store. In those countries, usually there is a licensed repair provider, but the customer experience can be drastically different. In Bulgaria, I've had to wait of over 3 weeks for a simple in-warranty repair of a MacBook, like a keyboard replacement. Using unlicensed repair stores has been t…

Given how hard these things are getting to repair and how long it takes, I think you could argue that Apple should just offer to replace faulty devices with new ones. Having a pro device out of action for more than a week is just not acceptable. If it breaks, I want to have the replacement up and running ASAP. If Apple can then repair and refurbish the original at their own leisurely pace, fine. That will also put th…

I'm not sure which country you are in, but in the Netherlands when I bring in my Apple devices in for repair I just order a brand new one that I return when I go pick up my device after it has been repaired. You need to have money for a new device obviously, you need to order it online and you have to return it within 14 days but it's a great way to be able to keep working.

For anyone who thinks this is an abuse of the system, I don't feel guilty doing this if Apple takes weeks to replace a keyboard, doesn't offer a temporary replacement or do on-site repair the next business day. I have offered my local Apple reseller money for these services but they won't do it. Somehow they are OK with me buying a brand new device and returning it for every repair.

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