The annoying habits of highly effective people • Hacker News Board

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#221

Post by sonnyblarney » Wed, Oct 03, 2018, 12:38 AM UTC

Kurtz79 wrote: post #123

sonnyblarney wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" it's a lot easier to get up at 5am, shake hands firmly, and dress for success" Let's not be superfluous. Being a CEO is hard, even the 5 am rising and 'hand shaking' parts.

I appreciate that the work is hard, what I cannot come to terms with is the apparent and total lack of accountability of the role (speaking about big-company CEOs). Yes, a "bad" CEO will be fired, meaning that he will pocket a fat severance package and he will be able to try again in another company with almost no stigma attached. Even if he did it so badly making himself unhireable for similar positions, he will hav…

Most CEO's don't do 'bad' as in illegal stuff, this is very rare. If they do really bad stuff their equity disintegrates.

The reason the golden parachutes exist is because CEO is likely going to be 'the end of the career' for most. There are so many reasons to get fired and it will probably happen. After that, there's not much else.

Nobody in their right mind would be a 'Big Co CEO' without some kinds of rewards even on the downside - many of these folks can make quite a lot of money in some other C-level position and do just fine right there. Why put your head on the chopping block?

You might also ask the question why athletes are paid gazillions for doing something fun, that they enjoy that comes with zero responsibility basically, and can often do very well even if they don't perform, although usually that's not the case.

And FYI most CEO's don't make gazillions of dollars, that's just what we see in the news.

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#222

Post by coldtea » Wed, Oct 03, 2018, 7:34 AM UTC

sonnyblarney wrote: post #205

coldtea wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but I can't think of a CEO job that isn't hard. It's always fraught with political risk, changing times, etc. etc That makes it volatile, not hard. And the stakes are much less for volatility when you already have several cool million in the bank...

No, it makes it hard. The CEO of an Ambulance company I know has about 500 staff, he's been doing it for 25 years, it all seems like a smooth operation but they're constantly facing issues. Labour and training problems, international actors that won't pay and their governments won't help, shipping problems, supply chain problems. Liability issues. IP issues with some special things they do. Orders come in batches, th…

Again, that's not hard as in big "physical or mental toll". Being a miner is hard. Being a surgeon is hard. Being a mathematician working on big problems is hard.

A CEO compared is a walk in the park. All those issues you've mentioned ("Labour and training problems, international actors that won't pay and their governments won't help, shipping problems, supply chain problems") are there in any business (even in a single person shop).

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#223

Post by coldtea » Wed, Oct 03, 2018, 7:35 AM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #191

coldtea wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Being a CEO is hard Much easier than many other jobs, from mining and nursing to jobs that single mothers do in 2 shifts. And with much more perks, respect, personal influence, and earnings...

It's all relative. Someone in life always has it worse than you and these positions just cant be compared like this in any productive discussion. Being a CEO doesn't mean you're the boss. It means you serve everyone, from employees to customers to shareholders, and are responsible for every single thing that happens. If someone doesn't do well, it's your fault. And being responsible for others livelihoods with every…

>Being a CEO doesn't mean you're the boss. It means you serve everyone, from employees to customers to shareholders, and are responsible for every single thing that happens.

Golden parachutes ensure that this responsibility means almost nothing. CEOs have driven whole companies to the ground, losing the jobs of thousands, and got their fat check in the end. Heck, even white collar crime goes largely unpunished.

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#224

Post by Broken_Hippo » Wed, Oct 03, 2018, 7:52 AM UTC

tomnipotent wrote: post #218

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't gain discipline by waking up earlier than necessary. If you don't need to be at work until noon, waking up at 5am doesn't add discipline to your life. Waking in time to go to work is discipline, but if you don't need to be at work until 9am, there is no need to wake any earlier than it takes you to get to work on time. Waking early for the sake of waking early or having general "discipline" isn't such a thi…

> You don't gain discipline by waking up earlier than necessary. You absolutely do. Please take a second to actually lookup the definition of the word. It may not be added discipline in your life, but it is for many other people that don't live with the same daily habits as you. You don't get to change the definition of a word to fit your narrative, sorry.

The point is that waking early is not inherently a thing of discipline. You can no more judge one's discipline by one's waking time any more than you can judge one's discipline by whether or not they play an instrument every day. Both can be part of a disciplined life, but neither are actual markers of it. Neither are going to suddenly give one more discipline in their life just by doing that one thing. It isn't a magic cure. This is definitely not changing the definition one bit - you have already provided it.

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#225

Post by dagw » Wed, Oct 03, 2018, 8:32 AM UTC

manigandham wrote: post #172

dagw wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Land a major deal or create a new product line that doubles revenue? You're getting to the top. Be in charge of the department/team that "lands a major deal or create a new product line that doubles revenue" and you're on your way to the top. Being the person who was in the office until 3 am working out the final details of that deal or fixing the show stopping bugs that let you actually launch the product won't get…

But that is your job, is it not? What is wrong with the person in charge of the entire department being recognized for meeting the goal? Are they not working hard in their position? What did they do before their current position and what is stopping you from getting to theirs? There's a tendency to minimize the work by others because we don't have the same perspective, but it's rarely ever accurate. Or helpful.

What is wrong with the person in charge of the entire department being recognized for meeting the goal?

If they played a material role in meeting the goals then nothing. The question is so much about who is getting recognized as who isn't getting recognized. If you want to get recognized and get ahead then simply putting your head down and doing hard work isn't going to get you there.

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#226

Post by trollishName » Wed, Oct 03, 2018, 6:03 PM UTC

dang wrote: post #209

uratool wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. how do you know you are not a screaming asshole that other people tolerate, with your inflated sense of self worth about your technical ability being your motivator for demanding more - so you call it success. Have you overcome any longstanding relationship issues with anyone in your life? have you supported someone through a mental breakdown? The very fact that you measure your success "over" your colleagues to m…

We've banned this account for repeatedly violating the site guidelines. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html (Also, it's not ok to have a trollish username on HN, since that basically trolls every thread the account posts to.)

Hey dang, no one fucking cares.

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#227

Post by tomnipotent » Wed, Oct 03, 2018, 7:37 PM UTC

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #224

tomnipotent wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You don't gain discipline by waking up earlier than necessary. You absolutely do. Please take a second to actually lookup the definition of the word. It may not be added discipline in your life, but it is for many other people that don't live with the same daily habits as you. You don't get to change the definition of a word to fit your narrative, sorry.

The point is that waking early is not inherently a thing of discipline. You can no more judge one's discipline by one's waking time any more than you can judge one's discipline by whether or not they play an instrument every day. Both can be part of a disciplined life, but neither are actual markers of it. Neither are going to suddenly give one more discipline in their life just by doing that one thing. It isn't a ma…

You seem to have a New Age definition of what discipline is. There is no such thing as an "inherit discipline".

A marine, doctor, rock star, sanitation worker, train operator, and professional athlete are all going to have drastically different things they consider good discipline.

If I have a problem responding to text messages in a timely manner, I can improve my personal discipline by introducing a new habit to take 5 minutes before I go to bed to reply to every message. If I have a problem with my weight I can start going to the gym and change what I eat, discipling myself to take more care of my body. If I have a problem finishing projects, I can discipline myself to set realistic goals and expectations of what "complete" means so I can feel more confident ending things.

Changing behavior to achieve a goal (whether it's self-imposed or from your boss) is by its very nature achieved through discipline.

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#228

Post by soalian » Thu, Oct 04, 2018, 11:17 AM UTC

vajrabum wrote: post #55

phakding wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well I don't even know what a cto does. I have been in many meetings with them, but besides making high level decisions and asking for status, I don't know what they do. Besides I was born in poverty and needed lot of efforts to be able to socialize with people born upper middle class. I can only imagine what else I need to learn to socialize within upper echelons. I can't explain it to you fully. Thanks for asking t…

It might be a good thing the next time you have a meeting with a CTO to ask them what they do what their jobs is before or after the meeting. I asked a VP that question at biotech company I was consulting at 15 years or so ago and the answer was very revealing. It didn't make me a VP or even a manager but I have a much better perspective on that level of management then I did before.

Would you mind expanding a bit on your experience with that particular VP, more specifically what you got from his answer?

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#229

Post by white-flame » Thu, Oct 04, 2018, 4:43 PM UTC

taurath wrote: post #195

white-flame wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In betting on opportunity, often times they have everything riding on it. Where does the "harm" you talk about come from? Usually it's because there are other responsibilities you're engaged with. If you literally give everything else up to focus on one thing, these barbs aren't in your life. I'm talking forgoing rent to crash with family/friends, eating ramen, selling/getting rid of your things, live on credit cards…

> You'd be surprised how much that frees you from the immediate "harm" you describe, but you also have nothing to fall back on.. All the things you described doing are the fallback options - you have to have a family and friends, things to sell, credit to burn. Even then, family or friends have less patience to carry you when you’re taking a moonshot unless they also have a lot they can fall back on.

Specifically, I meant there's nothing to fall back on at the end if the gamble didn't pay off. Your family/friends are sick of you, you have nothing left to sell, any credit is trashed, and your venture didn't pan out.

Re: The annoying habits of highly effective people

#230

Post by white-flame » Thu, Oct 04, 2018, 5:22 PM UTC

devdas wrote: post #107

white-flame wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In betting on opportunity, often times they have everything riding on it. Where does the "harm" you talk about come from? Usually it's because there are other responsibilities you're engaged with. If you literally give everything else up to focus on one thing, these barbs aren't in your life. I'm talking forgoing rent to crash with family/friends, eating ramen, selling/getting rid of your things, live on credit cards…

That sounds like a fairly large financial privilege to me. If you are working two jobs to just get enough food to survive, and your friends are in a similar situation, you don't have that opportunity or ability to take risks.

There are people who simply walk away from it all. None of these issues are truly and specifically "to survive", it's all chasing something.