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SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

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Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#491

Post by turtlecloud »

voodooranger wrote: post #469

you can’t disrupt or otherwise show up all of these players: the us/eu/russian/chinese space industries (and by extension the governments of china and russia), the oil industries of russia/saudi/usa, the major auto manufacturers, power companies, professional car and truck drivers, and the us dealership association (what am i forgetting), all of whom are politically very well connected, and some of whom have their ho…

Looks like a TESLA Denier here.

Musk screwed over and pissed off a lot of people. How is the response not justified?

Both shorts and longs got hurt by his tweet.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#492

Post by brisance »

EGreg wrote: post #380
threeseed wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just revisionist history and completely wrong. Steve Jobs pretty much set Apple on the premium goods track when he returned. The iMac, iPod, iPad, iPhone were all developed under his watch and all were premium priced. Apple has pushed the margins higher but that's only because the market can absorb it. Computing is more central to people's lives and they are willing to pay a premium for a good experience.

You are wrong. Apple’s pace of innovation has slowed dramatically. This latest phone is but one example. Here is what would have happened under Jobs: http://magarshak.com/blog/?p=234

Really? Name another smartphpone maker that ships as many VCSELs as Apple did last year. And name a wearable that does as much as the new Apple Watch.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#493

Post by bjl »

peteey wrote: post #431
not2b wrote: post #406

He was trying to bankrupt the short-sellers, and he was doing it by lying: the price would soar, their options would be called, and they'd lose their shirts, all for a lie. When you're head of a public company, that's a crime. Not only will the SEC come after him, but the short sellers can probably sue him too. I have huge respect for his engineering ability, but he has messed up badly. He's overextended and it seems…

The law says a lot of things. I'm ok with short sellers losing their shirts regardless.

Why the short seller hate? They play a very important role in exposing fraud and inefficient allocation of capital.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#494

Post by mhermher »

not2b wrote: post #406

He was trying to bankrupt the short-sellers, and he was doing it by lying: the price would soar, their options would be called, and they'd lose their shirts, all for a lie. When you're head of a public company, that's a crime. Not only will the SEC come after him, but the short sellers can probably sue him too. I have huge respect for his engineering ability, but he has messed up badly. He's overextended and it seems…

The longs who bought at the sub-420 peak can also sue.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#495

Post by rayiner »

likpok wrote: post #424
rayiner wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The SEC needs to prove he made a “materially” false and misleading statement. The Supreme Court has defined a “material” fact for purposes of the securities laws to mean that there is: > a substantial likelihood that the...fact would have been viewed by the reasonable investor as having significantly altered the “total mix” of information made available. If a statement is an obvious joke, no reasonable investor could…

Could the SEC use as evidence the fact that the price went up post-tweet, and down after Tesla recanted? That is arguably objective evidence of reasonable investors taking his tweet as a material fact to their trading strategies (i.e. by buying stock).

Yes. Its not dispositive, because “reasonable” is a legal abstraction (so it admits the possibility that there are unreasonable investors who don’t get the joke), but it’s evidence.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#496

Post by ajmurmann »

pvelagal wrote: post #489
chollida1 wrote: post #6

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

SEC suing Elon Musk is , quite frankly one of the most abhorrent actions a US govt agency can ever do against genuine American Entrepreneurship and American innovative spirit. There is not a single human being on the planet who comes close to Elon Musk when it comes to big , bold innovation and tech entrepreneurship who is putting his heart and soul into leading the human race into the future.

I love the work that Musk has done. Everyone has to play by the same rules though. We cannot bend the law because someone has otherwise done amazing work.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#497

Post by webninja »

johannes1234321 wrote: post #432
joering2 wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protonmail.

That might be technical protection, however the way the SEC gets access to mails is not on a technical level, but by sending out a letter "please send us all your mails on that topic" and if the response on such a request is not convincingly consistent you get into even more trouble.

This. At Toyota corporate, we had a meeting with a lawyer and the lawyer instructed in the event of an investigation (e.g. bad floor mats), provide all of the emails and documents. Make everything easily searchable, and keep emails for 3-4 years. People think that hiding evidence from your lawyer makes things better but according to the lawyer, it actually hurts the case by not being able to have information. So save everything! The Toyota I.T. department must’ve heard something different because outlook now erases all emails older than 90 days.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#498

Post by hooloovoo_zoo »

propman wrote: post #384
WheelsAtLarge wrote: post #363

The book The PayPal Wars: Battles with eBay, the Media, the Mafia, and the Rest of Planet Earth, details Musk's time at Paypal and pretty much describes him as an eventual hindrance rather than a help. He was eventually ousted from the company. Peter Thiel was the one that was able to nurse the company to success. He was vital to get the company started but eventually, he was difficult to work with. Looks to me that…

I can only think of Elon as the only person to create THREE multi billion dollar companies in wildly different industries. Elon is a fantastic CEO AND visionary. I personally know people who could be making double specifically work at spacex because they believe in his vision. Elon is able to get Supreme talent and productivity for pennies on the dollar. He’s able to market Tesla and spaceX to billions with such a po…

To be fair, Musk created neither Tesla nor Paypal.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#499

Post by DSingularity »

matwood wrote: post #107
empath75 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You say the shorts don't have any power to hurt tesla, but much of tesla's and elon musk's personal debt is backed by Tesla shares. If the price dips too low, it's potentially catastrophic for the company and him.

What exactly did the shorts do here? Musk has brought on all this scrutiny himself. The shorts didn't bail out Solar City, miss nearly every production target, use TSLA as a way to personally finance a lavish lifestyle, or commit securities fraud. The shorts are all over this stock because of issues like the above. They were not the cause of those issues.

Winner winner chicken dinner.

Lol. Musk over extended. Plain and simple. He played it risky and now, when it didn’t work out, he is pissed.

In response he waged war via twitter on those who took risks in the other direction. Would have been wiser for him to focus on finding a way to cut his losses so he can continue fighting. Instead he played with fire and was burned.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#500

Post by brisance »

ethbro wrote: post #205
stcredzero wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are Apple products different now that Jobs are gone? Yes. Jobs as local despot acted as a curb to bad decisions. Jobs had a vision which acted as a countervailing force to keep Apple from being completely sucked into being a money grubbing luxury goods company. the core people that make and design all their overpriced, planned obsolescence devices are still there, often uncredited, while everyone else likes to focus…

I never thought of Apple as the GE (and GE Capital) of the tech world, but the "do more of the thing that makes us the most money, at all costs" metaphor is starting to fit.

The NCPPR representative asked Mr. Cook to commit right then and there to doing only those things that were profitable.

What ensued was the only time I can recall seeing Tim Cook angry, and he categorically rejected the worldview behind the NCPPR's advocacy. He said that there are many things Apple does because they are right and just, and that a return on investment (ROI) was not the primary consideration on such issues.[1]

Apple leads in recycling, renewable energy use and privacy as well.

So, no, your thesis is flat out wrong.

[1] https://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/tim-cook-soundly-rej...

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