Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies • Hacker News Board

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#411

Post by lolc » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:19 PM UTC

dordoka wrote: post #284

braythwayt wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. That’s how values work. You VALUE them, meaning—objectively—you are willing to make some sacrifice for them. Same goes for working for a predatory financial institution, a manufacturer who makes dangerous products, or for that matter, a company with a toxic culture. How is this different from working for a tobacco company? Decades ago we had the same conversation about people who ”were just following orders.” If…

I reckon it´s not only money that they give value. Other intangibles might apply (as all family related issues). I agree that engineers might also have something to say, but we don´t actually have a clue if some of them actually expressed they concerns for this change, unless you have some insight from inside the company that you may not be able to share. Even if some of them left as you suggest, I´m pretty sure Goog…

Sure. If you have the monopoly, you don't need people to love you.

While Google could easily find engineers to implement anything, they can't as easily find people who know what to implement: People with a deep understanding of the web. The power grab we could observe over the last year has alienated a lot of people. In hindsight we will know whether that grab worked for them.

Right now, they are burning through goodwill at a high rate.

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#412

Post by Carpetsmoker » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:21 PM UTC

ux-app wrote: post #62

mangecoeur wrote: post #36

Seriously don't know why anyone is surprised that a browser built by an ad-tech company pushes the user tracking tech of that company. Just use Firefox and have done with it - there's been a series of these kinds of posts over the last couple of days with people suggesting insane workaround hacks instead of just changing their browser. P.S. if you keep chrome because some websites only work properly there, maybe y'al…

Dropping chrome is not enough. Switch to bing (Just as good as G), or ddg if you really want. Then ditch android which is the spy in your pocket. If you're installing G analytics for clients then choose an alternative (I'm open to suggestions here). It's really time to disentangle ourselves from google. They've quietly and effectively insinuated themselves across the web. Enough is enough.

What's the alternative to Android though? Apple has its own well-documented issues, as well as a rather large price-tag. I just use my phone for maps and some chat services, don't need a very fancy phone. Even the iPhone 7 is listed at £449, which is already £150 more than I paid for my Sony Xperia.

I wish stuff like HP WebOS or Meego was still alive, but as far as I know, Apple and Google are the only serious players in town at the moment :-(

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#413

Post by mrighele » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:21 PM UTC

ux-app wrote: post #62

mangecoeur wrote: post #36

Seriously don't know why anyone is surprised that a browser built by an ad-tech company pushes the user tracking tech of that company. Just use Firefox and have done with it - there's been a series of these kinds of posts over the last couple of days with people suggesting insane workaround hacks instead of just changing their browser. P.S. if you keep chrome because some websites only work properly there, maybe y'al…

Dropping chrome is not enough. Switch to bing (Just as good as G), or ddg if you really want. Then ditch android which is the spy in your pocket. If you're installing G analytics for clients then choose an alternative (I'm open to suggestions here). It's really time to disentangle ourselves from google. They've quietly and effectively insinuated themselves across the web. Enough is enough.

It would be nice also for websites to have an alternative to recaptcha. I hate to have to train google's models for free just to access a website. I'd prefer to do some work for data that can be openly accessed (OpenStreetMap for example).

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#414

Post by kmlx » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:23 PM UTC

jamesb93 wrote: post #146

kmlx wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i found that on my machines Chrome 69 is one of the fastest and consumes the least amount of ram of all Chrome releases so far. on mac the difference between firefox and chrome is night and day for both speed and memory consumption, unfortunately. even safari 12 fares better than firefox in this regard.

aer you saying chrome or ff uses less?

chrome 69 on macos using latest 15 inch macbook. much faster than chrome 68, and in a different league than firefox 62. different story on windows thou.

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#415

Post by wu-ikkyu » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:24 PM UTC

kryogen1c wrote: post #269

braythwayt wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. That’s how values work. You VALUE them, meaning—objectively—you are willing to make some sacrifice for them. Same goes for working for a predatory financial institution, a manufacturer who makes dangerous products, or for that matter, a company with a toxic culture. How is this different from working for a tobacco company? Decades ago we had the same conversation about people who ”were just following orders.” If…

This is a toothless, short-sighted, and self-serving philosophy that does not solve any problem. I will explain, but first let it be known that I am a scorned Google user. I jumped on board the magic carpet of every Google service as soon as I could and loved it the whole time, but it has become clear to me that Google and my values no longer align. So I'm leaving. However, telling the workers to "just quit" won't so…

>Change can come from internal activism and external Market pressures. Quitting is neither of those and actively contrary to the former.

False. A mass exodus of employees can certainly increase market pressures as it signals instability; it can also be extremely difficult (sometimes impossible) for new hires to understand big legacy code bases -- so quitting can be a form of legal/indirect sabotage

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#416

Post by laumars » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:24 PM UTC

jstanley wrote: post #353

swebs wrote: post #320

"Oh you want to take a moral stand? Ok, the door is that way. We've just successfully lobbied for a few hundred more H1B's that will do anything we tell them"

If the company is asking you to do things that you find ethically untenable, you should leave, even in full knowledge that the company will find a way to do it anyway.

In an ideal world, yes. But people have mortgages, families and other commitments. Some have social anxiety and find job hunting an impossibly scary prospect. Others might suffer from depression.

It's all good and well placing generalised ethics on individuals to do the right thing but in those kind of ideal world scenarios you also wouldn't have accountants finding tax loopholes, lawyers perpetuating patent abuse, nor company directors asking their staff to do morally objectionable things to begin with.

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#417

Post by edibleEnergy » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:26 PM UTC

Title of the post is not right, the author issued a (technically important) correction[1]:

> Brief correction: Cookies seem to get removed and re-created immediately. At least the cookie content and creation date seems to change. Nonetheless: After hitting the "remove all" button you still don't end up with an empty cookie jar.

[1]: https://twitter.com/ctavan/status/1044543955457773573

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#418

Post by patrec » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:27 PM UTC

paulie_a wrote: post #402

nathan_long wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"OK, no problem. Having Google on my resume means I can get a new job by the end of the week. I'll be sure to spread the word to users and developers alike that you're shady." Let's not pretend that developers are powerless.

Having Google on your resume is in no way impressive in my opinion. I have reviewed plenty of resumes and been part of the interview process. Being a Google employee just doesn't matter.

Your opinion is not representative and thus not relevant to the argument (that ex-Google engineers have very good job prospects).

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#419

Post by Elrac » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:27 PM UTC

mannykannot wrote: post #341

drawkbox wrote: post #63

Another confirmation that engineers and product developers are no longer in control at Google. Engineering and product first is how Google won the game initially, very easy to forget that when the money rolls in massively and the power structures move away from those driving forces. Microsoft already went through this engineering/product growth to bizdev/marketing control to stagnation and is already in the return to…

The idea that technical people are all impeccably ethical is not very plausible. Consider the scientists who promoted the claim that smoking was harmless long after it clearly was not, the engineers who concocted VW's diesel-emissions fraud, and the developers who produced Madoff's fake accounting. And, of course, this particular deception is hardly the first fall from grace on the internet.

I don't think anyone is seriously promoting that idea. The implication, rather, is a more modest proposal: That, of a company's staff, the bean counters and executives are at least on average more bottom-line-motivated and hence more likely to push for changes that will pull in cash at the expense of honesty, privacy or consistency with user expectations, when compared with the technical types.

Re: Chrome 69 will keep Google Cookies when you tell it to delete all cookies

#420

Post by ardy42 » Tue, Sep 25, 2018, 1:28 PM UTC

crunchlibrarian wrote: post #294

Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bing is nowhere near "(Just as good as G)". If it was, a lot more people would have already switched. As of now, it's surprisingly behind Google in almost all but the most basic searches.

Not really, Google has pushed the "relevancy customization" to it's extreme limit and the conclusion of this process is search results that are often just garbage. Not just in the filter bubble sense of keeping out any info that the targeted user might find unpleasant, but also in the sense that "we don't surface anything outside of very recent, very mainstream, large corporate sites" even when that's exactly what I…

> Not really, Google has pushed the "relevancy customization" to it's extreme limit and the conclusion of this process is search results that are often just garbage.

> Not just in the filter bubble sense of keeping out any info that the targeted user might find unpleasant, but also in the sense that "we don't surface anything outside of very recent, very mainstream, large corporate sites" even when that's exactly what I don't want to sift through on a given search.

I think this is why many people perceive Google Search to be "better." Those people are mainly looking for mainstream topics on a small number of mainstream sites, and Google has heavily biased their algorithm in that direction.

> It's a real pain if you're trying to do research in a niche area or in an academic field that isn't hip and popular, if you're not in the 90% bracket of the distribution results for what people click on you just don't exist on Google anymore.

> This phenomena is most obvious when you're searching for something that you know still exists on the web, you can remember it being a top result years ago, but has now been effectively eliminated from the results because it's not sitting on the domain of a large corporation. Bing will still surface these sites, at least for now.

You can also try using DDG or Google Verbatim mode: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12045959. Though, IMHO DDG is about as good as Google Verbatim.