Earlier quoted context omitted.
According to the article you can break even after only two weeks which is far from "10k cookies every day for multiple years".
I think the analogy holds. The numbers in the article assume constant usage (there is a nod to the cost of static storage, but all the math is done on $3/hr gpu usage, not $0.1/mo/GB storage). So if your usage is 4 hours per week, 50 weeks a year, you hit $600/year of gpu. If your usage is 24 hours a day, you hit $27k. So it's not a clear-cut "buying metal is cheaper" - you have to decide how your usage amortizes. As…
Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
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Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#42I don't see what's surprising here. This is the ski rental problem [0]. Would it surprise anyone to learn that renting a car is more expensive in the long run compared to buying one? This is the same thing, only the time scales are different. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ski_rental_problem
Because the cloud has economies of scale and benefits from specialization (cheaper power, bulk buying prices, remote land prices, etc) Hence, some of these saving should be passed on to consumers and it should be cheaper. The counter argument is that the cloud is over-engineered (redundancy, backups, better software) for enterprise customers. You u are paying for all these benefits whether u want to or not.
One is that AWS (and Azure and Google) are taking advantage of their brand recognition and are pricing their services extremely high compared to their competition. For some that is worth it as they need services they don't get elsewhere, but for a lot of people there are far cheaper cloud services out there. Sometimes even hybrid solutions (e.g. a particular problem with AWS are the absolutely insane bandwidth prices - if you "need" to store your data on S3 because they're the only ones you trust for durability or because it fits in with other parts of your workflow - but you access most objects regularly enough from outside AWS that bandwidth prices are a high part of your cost, for example, it can often pay to rent servers somewhere like Hetzner just to act as caches)
The other problem is that while it looks straightforward, as much as we might like to think so, servers are not as much of a commodity as we'd like to think. Components are.
The really big savings in running your own comes when you measure how much RAM you need and what CPU you need, and whether or not disk IO is an issue, and configure servers that fit your use better. If the cloud providers have instances that fit your needs, awesome, you can get a decent price (if you shop around). If they don't, you can easily end up paying a lot for components in your instances that you don't need.
When you don't know what you need, it might be ok to pay that premium, but as soon as you know what you need, there are many cases where buying your own allows you a degree of specialisation that does not pay for the cloud providers because it's better to provide a smaller range where they can get economy of scale. I've seen cases where e.g. being able to shove enough RAM in a server cut costs by 90% or more vs. splitting the load over multiple lower RAM cloud instances.
I'm not saying it will stay this way forever - there are certainly regularly more and more combinations that you can find decently priced cloud instances for - but there are still tons of cases where building your own (or having someone configure one for you) is so much cheaper that it's nearly crazy not to.
Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Last time I checked baking my own cookies is more expensive than just buying a bag at Walmart. Yes, but most likely they aren't of comparable quality
Quite likely, the Walmart ones are better, at least if it comes to taste and looks. Unless you're an expert baker. And then your cookies probably still aren't better, you will just claim they are, and it's polite to agree with that assessment. In fact, it's polite in our society to agree that any half-good DIY attempt has better quality than commercial equivalent, even though it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
And awful if you want anything resembling "real food". (Not blaming anyone for buying them, I buy pre-made cookies as well.)
But yes, getting a nice looking/tasting cookie might require a few tries.
Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#44Own hardware is always cheaper to buy than using a cloud service, but keeping it running 24/7 involves substantial costs. Sure, if you run a solo operation, you can just get up during the night to nurse your server, but at some point that no longer makes sense to do. Somewhere along the way we forgot about this and it's now perfectly normal to run a blog on a GKE 3 VM kubernetes cluster, costing 140 EUR/month.
In the end we started migrating to Hetzner, as they finally got servers that got close enough to be worth offloading that work to someone else. Notably Hetzner reached cost parity for us; AWS was still just as ridiculously overpriced.
There are certainly scenarios where using AWS is worth it for the convenience or functionality. I use AWS for my current work for the convenience, for example. And AWS can often be cheaper than buying hardware. But I've never seen a case where AWS was the cheapest option, or even one of the cheapest, even when factoring in everything, unless you can use the free tier.
AWS is great if you can justify the cost, though.
Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#45You're forgetting the cost of fighting IT in a bureaucratic corporation to get them to let you buy/run non-standard hardware Much easier to spend huge amounts of money of Azure/AWS and politely tell them it's their own fucking fault when they complain about the costs. (what me? no I'm not bitter, why do you ask?)
Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#46> Nvidia contractually prohibits the use of GeForce and Titan cards in datacenters. So Amazon and other providers have to use the $8,500 datacenter version of the GPUs, and they have to charge a lot for renting it.
Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#47I don't see what's surprising here. This is the ski rental problem [0]. Would it surprise anyone to learn that renting a car is more expensive in the long run compared to buying one? This is the same thing, only the time scales are different. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ski_rental_problem
Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#48Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#49Re: Building your own deep learning computer is 10x cheaper than AWS
#50Hardware is the easy part. Setting up and running the software stacks. Uptimes, etc are tricky.