Live data from Hacker News

How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

espn.com

51–60 of 63 posts

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#51
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The top competitor in a supposedly open competitive field is refusing to compete with [blank] players for fear of [blank] He's not refusing to compete with women. He's refusing to do two-person co-operative streams with them to reduce the amount of rumors and garbage that terrible people on the internet will create about him. > When the #2 spot is held by a female gamer, his refusal to play with female players is e…

Well the question is interesting when you look at the legal aspect instead of the 'I feel' aspect. If he deliberately refuses to play with some people based on a protected trait, it might be illegal. This seems like a much less clear cut case than e.g. having women and men basketball leagues. Your claim of 'freedom' doesn't (always) hold, you're not allowed (everywhere) to discriminate in all cases because of 'freedo…

That would be interesting, are there any existing laws which prohibit his current choice?

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#52
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The top competitor in a supposedly open competitive field is refusing to compete with [blank] players for fear of [blank]. So what, exactly, does that look like? Here's an easier experiment: play out a scenario to the extreme: When the #2 spot is held by a female gamer, his refusal to play with female players is exactly what you claim it's not. By refusing to play she will never get the chance to compete for the "top…

> The top competitor in a supposedly open competitive field is refusing to compete with [blank] players for fear of [blank] He's not refusing to compete with women. He's refusing to do two-person co-operative streams with them to reduce the amount of rumors and garbage that terrible people on the internet will create about him. > When the #2 spot is held by a female gamer, his refusal to play with female players is e…

I just read through these again, you might want to as well https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#53
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The top competitor in a supposedly open competitive field is refusing to compete with [blank] players for fear of [blank] He's not refusing to compete with women. He's refusing to do two-person co-operative streams with them to reduce the amount of rumors and garbage that terrible people on the internet will create about him. > When the #2 spot is held by a female gamer, his refusal to play with female players is e…

TLDR; Ad Hominem - doesn't do anything here. If one has a problem with harassment, then rationally one attacks the problem (harassment)...not the victim (women). Then there's Ninja... >You can criticize him for it all you want, that's your freedom to do so "freedom" is an interesting word choice, given the whole problem we're discussing Are you a gamer? Can you explain how gaming with girls works or doesn't work the…

> If one has a problem with harassment, then rationally one attacks the problem (harassment)...not the victim (women)

In this situation, the harassment is directed at Ninja and his wife, thus he and his wife are the victim, not women. Also it is not feasible for one person to "attack" the problem, which is that there are a lot of shitty people on the internet. I'm sure if he could "attack" it he would.

> Are you a gamer? Can you explain how gaming with girls works or doesn't work the point of excluding them?

I am to a degree, nothing competitive, but I at least understand how the game and streaming works. What he's made very clear is when he streams one-on-one with women, there's an increase in rumor youtube videos, hate mail, harassment, and attacks against him, his wife, and others who may be involved. He doesn't want that, thus he doesn't stream with them.

> More importantly does Ninja "streaming" with a random player, give that player massive exposure & potential opportunity?

Yes it does. But note that streaming with Ninja is not the exclusive way to gain subscriptions and viewers on the platform. And yeah it sucks that he doesn't stream with women but that's still his choice to make.

> It doesn't help prove how Ninja's actions are helpful to a "community."

I'm not trying to prove that it's helpful to the community. The community is mostly garbage anyway, have you ever seen the chat in a stream? I'm just saying he made a personal choice that, by what we've observed so far, is his to make.

> I'm actually more concerned about the indirect - which is highlighted by responses like yours.

Please say your point explicitly. _What_ is highlighted by my response?

It comes down to this: We're talking about a guy who plays video games while other people watch. And people want to mandate _who_ he plays with. What right do they have to demand that?

Edit: I do want to say, if it turns out there is a law which prohibits what he's doing, then I find that interesting and would no longer defend his right to do so. Perhaps if his twitch channel is defined as a company and his co-streamers are legally his "employees", then I could see there being a case. Interested to hear from anyone who is educated in these legal matters.

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#54
post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty god damn smart, work hard for 10 years and have generational wealth for the rest of your god damn life. He knows that this was a lucky break of fame, and as celebrities rise and fall with fads. It's way better than most startups.

There's got to be some boundary, though. The guy streams every single day. Doesn't even take one weekday off. That's not healthy.

Working until you're 80 isn't healthy either. given the choice I'd rather do 10 years with no free time than 60 years with only a tiny bit of free time.

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#55
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TLDR; Ad Hominem - doesn't do anything here. If one has a problem with harassment, then rationally one attacks the problem (harassment)...not the victim (women). Then there's Ninja... >You can criticize him for it all you want, that's your freedom to do so "freedom" is an interesting word choice, given the whole problem we're discussing Are you a gamer? Can you explain how gaming with girls works or doesn't work the…

> If one has a problem with harassment, then rationally one attacks the problem (harassment)...not the victim (women) In this situation, the harassment is directed at Ninja and his wife, thus he and his wife are the victim, not women. Also it is not feasible for one person to "attack" the problem, which is that there are a lot of shitty people on the internet. I'm sure if he could "attack" it he would. > Are you a ga…

> Please say your point explicitly. _What_ is highlighted by my response?

You are defending and rationalizing a passive form of sexism as normal: It's just a game... Other people made him do it... He's protecting himself/his wife... It's just the streaming part... etc

Ninja has earned his influence, fame, and profit. He is a business/brand that monetizes a massive (growing) following of idolizing young boys/men who now think gender segregation and exclusion is noble.

The ninja situation makes me sad when I think about my mother. It makes me angry when I think about my daughter.

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#56
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Third world does not have to do with the size of the economy. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_World

You should read what you post, it was coined doing the Cold War but it had to do with developing countries and their economy back when influence was king. The Cold War ended 20 years ago though, and since then the term started to mean “poor/backwards” countries. Now in the case if Brazil, you’re post-industrialized country with the worlds 9th largest economy. You simply don’t fit any definition of the “third world”.

Just to remind you that we are all getting old -- its much closer to 30 years since the cold war ended.

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#57
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If one has a problem with harassment, then rationally one attacks the problem (harassment)...not the victim (women) In this situation, the harassment is directed at Ninja and his wife, thus he and his wife are the victim, not women. Also it is not feasible for one person to "attack" the problem, which is that there are a lot of shitty people on the internet. I'm sure if he could "attack" it he would. > Are you a ga…

> Please say your point explicitly. _What_ is highlighted by my response? You are defending and rationalizing a passive form of sexism as normal: It's just a game... Other people made him do it... He's protecting himself/his wife... It's just the streaming part... etc Ninja has earned his influence, fame, and profit. He is a business/brand that monetizes a massive (growing) following of idolizing young boys/men who n…

> You are defending and rationalizing a passive form of sexism as normal

I didn't defend it as being normal, I said he's free to make that choice (unless it's illegal?). I wouldn't have made that choice in his position but I don't really have a say in the matter.

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#58
post #24

Every day, people tune in by the hundreds of thousands to watch him play, and he's making bank doing it. The most commonly reported figure is $500,000 a month. Blevins suggests the number is closer to seven figures. And then later: "Until my family is taken care of. Say this ends tomorrow, we don't have enough for the rest of our lives. I tell Jess, 'Honey, we're not going to have that much quality time this year, or…

It's pretty god damn smart, work hard for 10 years and have generational wealth for the rest of your god damn life. He knows that this was a lucky break of fame, and as celebrities rise and fall with fads. It's way better than most startups.

there's no guarantee he lasts beyond a month. streaming is very "fad" driven. follow the memes.

you're also ruling things like health issues, etc.

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#59
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Please say your point explicitly. _What_ is highlighted by my response? You are defending and rationalizing a passive form of sexism as normal: It's just a game... Other people made him do it... He's protecting himself/his wife... It's just the streaming part... etc Ninja has earned his influence, fame, and profit. He is a business/brand that monetizes a massive (growing) following of idolizing young boys/men who n…

> You are defending and rationalizing a passive form of sexism as normal I didn't defend it as being normal, I said he's free to make that choice (unless it's illegal?). I wouldn't have made that choice in his position but I don't really have a say in the matter.

>It comes down to this: We're talking about a guy who plays video games while other people watch. And people want to mandate _who_ he plays with. What right do they have to demand that?

This is called rationalizing...

Re: How Ninja become gaming's first crossover star

#60
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems contradictory. People from third world countries have a thicker skin but don’t play games because the abuse controls aren’t strong enough? I can understand some part of this. Shit talking is not automatically abusive. But if you’re playing, and someone says “bitch you suck stop playing” repeatedly, I really can’t blame you for not playing anymore. This is not as cultural as it is psychological IMHO: if you…

I mean that the abuse controls prevent me from having a good time because they're too tight. For instance, the Overwatch developers prevented people from saying "gg ez" at the end of a match because they deemed it too abusive. This kind of view towards abuse is too extreme to me and eventually sapped my will to play that particular game.

Yea, sounds like you have a culture mismatch, I wouldn’t play either if I had pet phrases I couldn’t say.
Post reply on HN