Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How America lost its love for the stick shift

cnbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

251–260 of 729 posts

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#251

Post by Xurinos »

0x00000000 wrote: post #208
t0mbstone wrote: post #163

Speaking as someone who has owned a number of sports cars with manual transmissions, I can tell you why I finally made the switch to automatic: Adaptive cruise control in stop and go traffic. I used to have to deal with a six-speed manual transmission in stop and go traffic for an hour every day, and it was pure torture. I mean, sure, it was fun for a weekend drive in the mountains, but it sucked the rest of the time…

To each their own, but stop and go traffic does not exist in the absence of stoplights if you leave adequate space in front of you. If you tailgate, ride your brakes, or have to stop completely you are contributing to traffic jams behind you. I drive a 6 speed in one of the worst traffic areas in the US every day.

To all the folks replying that someone will fill the gap in front of you: that’s the point. It isn’t about reaction time. It’s about letting traffic flow easier, not fighting with each other.

It removes the need for your fellow drivers to feel a tension when it is time to switch lanes, to not have to make a risky maneuver. You get to relax when driving because now you aren’t competing to get to your destination, and you can feel more confident others are not going to accidentally hit you in a desperate attempt to go where they are going.

That impatient driver behind you? They will get around you and play the rat race. Let them. Most drivers don’t do that unless you are much obviously slower than traffic flow. Let people win the game they are playing. You are making it generally safer, and your consistency on the road helps them make decisions easier.

I’ve been doing this for about 10 years. No accidents, no cause of accidents, no angry honkers, none of that nonsense. Try it for a week! Give others space to move. Watch traffic jams ease up a little around you. It’s very neat. My space clears spaces so I can move easier after people get in front of me. I’ve seen others follow my example (or be their own example).

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#252

Post by drblast »

I'll concede all of the other advantages of automatics and add getting the car moving from a stop on a hill in Seattle, but there seems to be no way to get rid of the latency when I need to downshift right now, is there?

I hate that about automatics. Floor the gas, count 1,2...ok here we go.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#253

Post by swebs »

mulmen wrote: post #50
AWildC182 wrote: post #29

I like manuals because they feel better to me. This is totally anecdotal but to me it seems like the stick keeps me more engaged with what's happening with the car so I find I tend to be less distracted. It also occupies a hand so it definitely prevents a lot of phone usage. If this could actually be proved I'd definitely welcome a return to manual transmissions as sometimes I feel like the only person not on their p…

We should just revoke drivers licenses for people who can't operate cars responsibly. It's way too easy to get a license and keep one in the US today. We don't even re-test.

I doubt people would use their phones during the test.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#254

Post by bsder »

0x00000000 wrote: post #208
t0mbstone wrote: post #163

Speaking as someone who has owned a number of sports cars with manual transmissions, I can tell you why I finally made the switch to automatic: Adaptive cruise control in stop and go traffic. I used to have to deal with a six-speed manual transmission in stop and go traffic for an hour every day, and it was pure torture. I mean, sure, it was fun for a weekend drive in the mountains, but it sucked the rest of the time…

To each their own, but stop and go traffic does not exist in the absence of stoplights if you leave adequate space in front of you. If you tailgate, ride your brakes, or have to stop completely you are contributing to traffic jams behind you. I drive a 6 speed in one of the worst traffic areas in the US every day.

> To each their own, but stop and go traffic does not exist in the absence of stoplights if you leave adequate space in front of you. If you tailgate, ride your brakes, or have to stop completely you are contributing to traffic jams behind you. I drive a 6 speed in one of the worst traffic areas in the US every day.

Come over to Los Angeles and take me to work for a week and we'll see how well you can make that work.

As someone who drove a stick shift far too often in LA traffic jams, I understand your point and agree with it. You have to try really hard to juuust get to the car in front as it's starting to accelerate or you will burn the heck out of your clutch.

However, if you leave the appropriate gap, someone WILL jump into it in LA. And the people behind you will start frothing at the mouth.

It's really hard to be nice to a clutch in Los Angeles.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#255

Post by bigger_cheese »

taeric wrote: post #225
bigger_cheese wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was learning to drive my parents taught me in an old early 80's beat up station wagon. It was manual and had no power steering and the worst clutch I've ever used to this day. It took me a long time to learn to drive. A few years later they sold the car and both my sisters learnt to drive in more modern automatics. My learning experience was miserable but after learning in that old crappy wagon I can drive jus…

Would you teach someone on a vehicle without power steering? :) Our truck has bad power steering. Such that it often handles as if it didn't have it. Holy crap is that a pain.

I definitely would not recommend. Manual I think is ok to learn but I'd insist on power steering and modern safety features.

I own a manual currently. One big disadvantage (or possibly an advantage...) is when Friends ask to borrow car you need to ask "Can you drive a manual?" 9/10 times I've found answer is no.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#256

Post by taeric »

BeetleB wrote: post #228
taeric wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is dangerous, as you aren't signaling people behind you if you are braking... Edit: I would likely soften the "dangerous" wording above. I'm not trying to claim this is guaranteed to get you killed. Just pointing out that bypassing a well established signaling mechanism of your vehicle should be a deliberate act. Not one of convenience.

>This is dangerous, as you aren't signaling people behind you if you are braking... Engine braking results in a slow drop in speed. If the car behind you cannot handle a slow speed decline, he is the problem, and is driving too close to you. Most good instructors teach students to try to slow down as much as possible just by getting your foot off the accelerator (not with engine braking, and not with real brakes). As…

As I said up thread, there is usually a big difference in what folks refer to as engine braking and coasting a bit. In particular, my stick shift will slow dramatically faster when I engine brake in first/second compared to what will happen in any automatic I've ever driven. (In particular, it is entirely possible for me to completely engine brake to a stop sign. That is considerably more than just coasting to a stop.)

Also as I said, though, I should have been a bit softer there. I'm not saying it will get you in trouble guaranteed. But, just as I agree it is more dangerous to ride a bike without a helmet, I recommend against not signaling folks behind you that you are stopping.

And, also as I mentioned up thread. If someone hits you because they didn't see you stopping, yes, it is their fault. I don't exactly care who is at fault in many ways, if I'm hit. I'd just as soon not get hit. :)

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#257

Post by newnewpdro »

mikestew wrote: post #95
newnewpdro wrote: post #67

This article completely misses what I have observed as a major factor in nearly everyone switching to automatics: Drunk driving became illegal, then agressively enforced. This created a powerful incentive for having a vehicle anyone can drive. All my friends growing up were gearheads of some kind, and drove manual cars. Now they have automatics, so they can continue to get drunk when out and have someone sober (their…

Don't forget letting the female half of the population drive in the US is a relatively new development as well... Do you mean to say "new" as in "before this old man who is bordering on retirement was born"? Maybe you city folk kept the ladies in the passenger seat, but out on the farm and you don't drive stick, you're not much use. My long-dead grandmother drove everything from the farm truck full of livestock for t…

Any societal shift I can clearly see in my lifetime beginning with my grandparents spanning into my generation I consider relatively new.

Hell it's still a novelty to see coverage of women in automobile racing. Even when they aren't competitive, the media will broadcast their image just for participation alone.

Culturally, it's still fairly common to hear comments about women drivers being inferior.

So I think we're clearly not even out of the woods yet today.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#258

Post by taeric »

BeetleB wrote: post #231
jedberg wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Engine breaking just means slowing down by letting the foot off the gas. You aren't really slowing down that quickly. Someone has to really not be paying attention to miss it. It would be the equivalent of someone merging.

>Engine breaking just means slowing down by letting the foot off the gas. Given how often I've driven on stretches of road where engine braking is prohibited, I beg to differ. Engine braking is usually braking by shifting to a lower gear.

I will chime into that, though, that they are prohibiting large trucks from doing it. They don't care about cars doing it. (The wikipedia page explains the difference and why some places prohibit trucks from doing it.)

Edit: That said, I fully agree that most times I hear folks talk of engine braking, they mean shifting down to slow somewhat faster than just coasting.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#259

Post by emodendroket »

mertd wrote: post #246
emodendroket wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People always say this, but frankly I find stop-and-go traffic isn't that bad if you put the car into neutral instead of holding down the clutch the whole time. I haven't looked back since I bought my first manual car. I never use cruise control at all though, even when I had an automatic car.

The key word in the parent post is "adaptive". With adaptive CC, you don't do anything in stop and go traffic other than minor steering. The car just keeps about a car length distance with the car in front. It is very nice convenience feature.

I'm familiar with the concept, but I can't imagine I'd use it any more than I use regular cruise control on an empty highway.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#260

Post by rootusrootus »

setr wrote: post #247
rootusrootus wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, the OP didn't suggest taking away cars from poor people, just from people who can't be bothered to learn to drive responsibly.

If you take cars away from every group equally, then the poor are the least capable of finding an alternative (because they usually cost). In fact, if you take anything from the entire population in equal measure, its bound to affect the poor the most (because they’re the least capable of finding alternatives to the status quo). So in any such argument, they’d naturally become the front of the topic. If anyone is goi…

Then why have any standards at all, if any expectations are discrimination?
Post reply on HN