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Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

economist.com

81–90 of 234 posts

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#81
I find a stark and surprising contradiction from some people these days - they simultaneously insist that social media, most specifically Facebook, helps them feels ‘connected’ to their friends and family and yet they feel increasingly lonely.

Maybe if you live your life in Facebook you don’t have as much to talk about with your friends when you interact in person?

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#82

There have always been people who wanted to be lonely though, just as there have always been people who wanted constant socializing. Both have their own problems when taken to extremes, i.e: Extreme socialization leads to group-think and collectivism[1], and extreme loneliness leads to despair and becoming overly withdrawn. I (personally) try to find a balance between the two, often withdrawing back into a hermit exi…

> There have always been people who wanted to be lonely

I think you’re conflating ‘lonely’ and ‘alone’. Wanting to be alone is healthy, wanting to be lonely would be very unhealthy.

It’s the difference between wanting to sit by the fire and wanting to be burned - the latter invites/desires pain and harm.

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#83
post #25

I've watched Friends last year for the first time in my life and it was shocking to me, among other 90s things, how everyone is dating left and right, one after another as if they were in a race or something. I don't know your social circle but in mine, currently it's quite the opposite. I observe that less and less people go out/date/interact with each other socially, which is sad.

Friends is quaint. Thanks to dating applications in major cities (NYC, Paris, London, Bangkok, Shanghai) it's possible for a reasonably attractive man to go on multiple dates a night for weeks on end. There's also literally endless functions, meetups and places to hang out... if you can afford it. Outside of the cities, particularly in the US, it's shocking how mechanical and isolated people become. The combination o…

> In its place you find isolated exurb drug-addled dystopias. It's a bit horrifying.

I think you may have spent more time reading Atlantic articles and listening to documentary podcasts about small town America than you’ve actually spent in it.

It is still alive and well, in pretty much the way you describe, in many/most small towns.

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you 100% but I have an interesting personal anecdote, pretty much the opposite. When I was young I was very shy, painfully shy even into my early 20s. All social outings were family reunions or church. But I liked computers. So in the early 1990s I bought a computer and tried this thing called the Internet. By chance I discovered IRC. It was a world of strangers who interacted in real time. I could conve…

I think it’s fair to consider IRC a social tool. It’s build around small communities made up of people who both belong to and run the various rooms. So within that you have a social structure, you have familiarity and you have social hierarchies. This is different from most “social” platforms on the modern web. Reddit, twitter, Facebook, Snapchat, instagram, hackernews and so on are all global villages, operated by a…

I don't think is has that much to do with technology. Just that the people who got online in the 90s were likely more curious about new things and other people than the general population (while there were certainly exceptions). The opposite is probably true today, especially in things like tech or other general Internet things.

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#85
> But this need not make them lonelier. Snapchat and Instagram may help them feel more connected with friends.

There is an important difference between being connected in a shallow digital sense and being emotionally connected. Staring at screen looking at attention seeking pictures and clips from peers and then clicking on a like button or writing a comment is not going to come even close to something that will leave participants feeling spiritually connected.

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#86
post #2

If anyone is looking for adventure and connection, I run a group called Founders Hike, which is what it sounds like. Founders get together to mastermind, hike and support each other about once a month. We have some really successful and amazing Founders. Nature is it’s own medicine, the community is great, and the wisdom runs deep. NYC / SF and chapters forming in other cities. Email me if you’d like to join, and I’l…

Do you dance around a giant wooden owl wearing still warm severed sheep heads while 1998 Alex Jones records on VHS in the woods?

Dude. You know the first rule of Founders Hike is not to talk about Founders Hike.

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#87

Another thing I wondered about is the impact of automation and volatility on, for lack of a better word 'involuntary' micro social interactions. Until fairly recently people had 'forced' social interactions when doing their finances, shopping etc. Even if involuntary they 'trained' people's social skills and withered away at their acquired/innate social anxiety. Furthermore, even in these situations the persons you i…

I have similar worries about AI. Example: I never let computer programs reply for me by clicking pre-written responses to emails or messages. The designers of those products are making the mistake that the less you have to think about things the better, but I think that you have to use your brain or you will lose it. Even those simple routine tasks (like talking to a bank teller for three minutes) provide essential cognitive exercise.

I don't refer to tech devices as "smart" any more -- they are "stupid" phones and "stupid" speakers, because that's what they are going to do to people in the long run. Programmers shouldn't try to make computers think for people or automate too much, because even smaller thinking tasks are essential.

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#88
post #76

Have you seen the movie "Shawshank Redemption"? It makes an interesting point about becoming institutionalized. There was an inmate that was released after ~50 years,he committed suicide because he couldn't adopt to living outside of the prison system. What they call the loneliness epidemic these days is a bit like that. In fact,I would say loneliness is social imprisonment. For one reason or the other individuals en…

Very interesting. I wonder if the shift of placing babies in daycare is a factor.

A Dad or Mom will want to interact with a baby. In a daycare situation it's their job to interact with the babies. And at times if a baby isn't causing a problem, they are left alone.

Could it be an early connection is being missed?

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#89
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be very surprised if anyone who would join a Founders Hike is wealthy as a founder, especially if they are suffering from loneliness.

You’d be surprised how many of the billion dollar company founders I coach come in the door with deep loneliness.

You're right, we would be.

Well, I don't doubt that some rich people are very lonely....I doubt you actually come into contact with them.

Feel like you're just a wannabe Bill Campbell. I went to your site - you sell Ultimate T-shirts.

Re: Loneliness is pervasive and rising, particularly among the young

#90
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was commonly understood in medieval times. Aquinas says our mutual dependency forms social ties.

This is kind out of scope, but ever since Deus Ex (the game), I have wondered what the big deal about Aquinas is. Never found his work all that interesting.

I read a bit of him in college - what he pushed isn't all that special now nor something that stands out as a "holy crap" like predicting the existence of atoms but he had some influence with theodicy and other catholic foundations. While qualifying that a woman isn't at fault for being raped if she didn't enjoy it is horrifyiny misogynistic it was sadly progressive for his day. One amusing thing he had to argue against was that the Roman Empire fell due to abandoning the old gods and that if God was a real/superior power then they shouldn't have fallen.
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