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Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

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Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#121

Post by irq11 »

waterhouse wrote: post #81
cgarrigue wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luckily the work culture is slowly changing, at least regarding the matter of OT: following the suicide of a new recruit of Dentsu that was ruled to be a death by overwork, several companies started to ask their employees to refrain from doing OT. However, as an engineer, it is sometimes quite frustrating to work with colleagues who do not want to try anything by themselves, because they want to be taught everything.…

> this limits innovation, because nobody wants to do something new. Curious. The stuff that I've read about Toyota says they have "continuous improvement" as a core principle[1]. Does that just not carry over into the way they do software, or is Toyota an anomaly among Japanese companies, or what? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota#Company_strategy

The OP is making stereotypes, and they aren’t universally true (as is usually true for stereotypes).

Japan is a big place. There are all kinds of people, and plenty of innovative organizations. It’s frankly embarrassing, the amount of nonsense that people are spouting in this thread.

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#122

Post by ericdykstra »

ousta wrote: post #96
xaranke wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you comment on whether racism is still a thing in Japanese society?

There isnt a mono-ethnic country in the world where you won't face racism much worse than in multicultural societies as you will always be different. People don't call it racism there. its normal for you not to be treated like a japanese as you re not one. and don't worry they will make you feel that everyday. especially when they will see that you speak japanese and that you re not a tourist

I wouldn't call it racism, either. Recognizing that different cultures and peoples are different isn't racism, and I wouldn't ever expect people to treat me as a Japanese, because I'm not one. That doesn't mean I'm not treated as an equal, it just means I'm not treated as the same (as I'm obviously not).

I'm thinking of writing a blog post or something about this in a positive light, since most of what you read about Japan in English is from the perspective of people who have a bone to pick with their experience. There's positives and negatives of being an integrated minority in what is by some definitions an ethnostate. I might even say there's some "minority privilege," depending on the situation.

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#123

Post by Someguywhatever »

RobertRoberts wrote: post #111
ericdykstra wrote: post #8

I love living and working in Japan, but I wouldn't recommend moving here unless you're committed to becoming fluent in Japanese and integrating into the culture. This is probably mostly true for any country one could move, but Japanese is one, if not the hardest language to learn for native English speakers. I do, however, recommend everyone visit! Japan is a beautiful country with a unique culture and has something…

I really think any techie would appreciate the consitency of two of the three alphabets in Japanese. (Hiragana and Katakana) The very fact that both of these alphabets are the exact same phonetic pronunciations, but written slightly different to visually distinguish them, is the only complication. But that they are designed specifically to distinguish between Japanese and foreign words is just brilliant. Their Kanji…

Would it be possible to learn only Hirigana/Katakana and ignore Kanji altogether?

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#125

Post by stealthcat »

RobertRoberts wrote: post #111
ericdykstra wrote: post #8

I love living and working in Japan, but I wouldn't recommend moving here unless you're committed to becoming fluent in Japanese and integrating into the culture. This is probably mostly true for any country one could move, but Japanese is one, if not the hardest language to learn for native English speakers. I do, however, recommend everyone visit! Japan is a beautiful country with a unique culture and has something…

I really think any techie would appreciate the consitency of two of the three alphabets in Japanese. (Hiragana and Katakana) The very fact that both of these alphabets are the exact same phonetic pronunciations, but written slightly different to visually distinguish them, is the only complication. But that they are designed specifically to distinguish between Japanese and foreign words is just brilliant. Their Kanji…

Japanese grammar structure is almost total inverse of English, worse, it has particle 'screws' system to make sense of any sentence.

Japanese vocab is not robust to noise, i.e. it is high-entropy. Unlike English, there are tons of homophones, plus, its intolerance to dropped/swapped phonemes usually lead to words confusion and incomprehensible sentences to beginners

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#126

Post by anjc »

tokyoHacker wrote: post #112
laum wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s still there at an institutional and cultural level - I think the most glaring example of this is the amount of landlords who either openly or discreetly (with a phone call to your realtor) will not rent property to foreigners.

I think this has more to do with the fact that the landlord is not comfortable dealing with someone who doesnt speak the same language. Also I have heard ( no citations) from my Japanese collegues that the laws are heavily biased in favor of the tenant. Its very hard to evict them. So a Japanese home owner ( conservative as they are) wouldn’t want to take a risk for no additional advantage.

> I think this has more to do with the fact that the landlord is not comfortable dealing with someone who doesnt speak the same language.

Language is always used as an excuse, but language doesn't seem to be a hindrance in any other country.

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#127

Post by ericdykstra »

irq11 wrote: post #121
waterhouse wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> this limits innovation, because nobody wants to do something new. Curious. The stuff that I've read about Toyota says they have "continuous improvement" as a core principle[1]. Does that just not carry over into the way they do software, or is Toyota an anomaly among Japanese companies, or what? [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota#Company_strategy

The OP is making stereotypes, and they aren’t universally true (as is usually true for stereotypes). Japan is a big place. There are all kinds of people, and plenty of innovative organizations. It’s frankly embarrassing, the amount of nonsense that people are spouting in this thread.

Indeed, there is a lot of innovation happening in Japan. Most of it isn't software or sexy industries that get all the news in American press, though.

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#128

Post by Grue3 »

Someguywhatever wrote: post #123
RobertRoberts wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really think any techie would appreciate the consitency of two of the three alphabets in Japanese. (Hiragana and Katakana) The very fact that both of these alphabets are the exact same phonetic pronunciations, but written slightly different to visually distinguish them, is the only complication. But that they are designed specifically to distinguish between Japanese and foreign words is just brilliant. Their Kanji…

Would it be possible to learn only Hirigana/Katakana and ignore Kanji altogether?

No. You won't be able to read anything that isn't designed to be read by kindergarteners if you can't read kanji (at least primary-school level [1]). But even learning the most common ones is really useful.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%8Diku_kanji

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#129

Post by xaranke »

Raphmedia wrote: post #86
xaranke wrote: post #18

Are there really a lot of these people? Don't get me wrong, Japan is truly a wonderful place to visit but living there seems like playing life on "hard mode" as compared to other countries: new language and culture, never truly becoming "one of them", and relatively poor working conditions. Unless you have existing ties to the place, it seems hard to believe that people will move in droves; although I can understand…

> Unless you have existing ties to the place, it seems hard to believe that people will move in droves; although I can understand a few people moving. The opposite is also true. You can grow so bored of western culture that Japan become interesting with its different way of life. It is however quite a bit "western" in some ways (compared to China, some of the middle east, etc.) so moving there can sound like a challe…

This is a Eurocentrist view, but you're not wrong.

Re: Some Techies Are Shunning Silicon Valley for the Japanese Dream

#130

Post by ethbro »

dfsegoat wrote: post #107
cgarrigue wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luckily the work culture is slowly changing, at least regarding the matter of OT: following the suicide of a new recruit of Dentsu that was ruled to be a death by overwork, several companies started to ask their employees to refrain from doing OT. However, as an engineer, it is sometimes quite frustrating to work with colleagues who do not want to try anything by themselves, because they want to be taught everything.…

>> who do not want to try anything by themselves, because they want to be taught everything Anecdotally, from a recent podcast on military history, I heard this same explanation for why the Japanese Army did very poorly in some WWII battles where they lost commanding officers early in the fight: The footsoldiers were unable to think for themselves, unable to adapt/improvise, and unable to organize anything other than…

Source? Because that's distilling a lot of complicated history down to a simple motivation.

Given that glorification of suicide was specifically taught to military recruits, and that various commanders promoted or dissuaded it to their subordinates, it would fair to say that many times Japanese suicide charges were ordered in-spite-of better ideas.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banzai_charge#In_World_War_II

Better support for overly rigid, hierarchical structures would come from the performance of upper echelon commanders during the war, and an inability to adapt doctrine to rapidly improving technology (e.g. mixed air-ground-sea task forces, carrier tactics, and radar).

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