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Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

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101–110 of 166 posts

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#101
post #97

Didn't Freeman Dyson talk about this idea? https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/12/the-dan...

I believe in climate change (and Dyson does too, he just doesn't like the alarmism) but Dyson is a very interesting person and clearly should be taken seriously.

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#102
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you George Carlin?

Ah, yes, that's where I first heard that thought! Thanks, just a bit of cryptomnesia. https://youtu.be/BB0aFPXr4n4?t=144 Side note: something I've never seen before on that Youtube video: it links the Wikipedia page for climate change right under the video. An attempt to battle misleading videos perhaps?

The Wikipedia links are a new initiative Google is doing to combat fake news and misleading information [0].

0: https://youtube.googleblog.com/2018/07/building-better-news-...

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#103
post #51
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Gaia theory suggests that the world is full of these stabilizing systems. Earth may have tricks to save its ecosystem, one of them could be temporarily increase temperatures and sea levels, just enough to end humanity.

It is exceedingly unlikely that raised temperatures or sea levels would end humanity. Even if all ice melts there would still be a lot of land, and humans can and do currently survive in hot climates. The habitable zone will just shrink a bit, but it will also expand in other places. Siberia + 5 degrees is still cold.

No, this is very wrong. It’s not about having land to live on and being able to continue to breathe on it. Of course we would be able to do that.

The issue is all the parts of the ecosystem we have come to rely on. Animals, plants, insects... the entire global economy and our ways of live are tightly intertwined with everything else and even small disruptions can have enormous repercussions, especially on more vulnerable populations in the world.

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#104
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not expect that we will be able to move past fossil fuels in the next 100 years. There is simply no other source of energy with as much density and as convenient as oil. The only think we know that can rival oil is nuclear energy but it has problems of its own.

Honestly, there's a lot of stuff I'm skeptical about what will happen in the next 100 years. I don't think that fossil fuels will be a thing in 100 years though. I think we'll have something smarter figured out. Think about how much time has passed since 1918 and what we achieved in that time frame.

Exactly, we haven't achieved that much actually. Most of the technology we use for harvesting energy is not much further from what people could imagine in 19th century. Turbine was invented in the 19th century.

I really suggest watching this talk by Smil https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5guXaWwQpe4 and if you are interested reading some books from him about energy and oil. Really insightful.

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#105
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not expect that we will be able to move past fossil fuels in the next 100 years. There is simply no other source of energy with as much density and as convenient as oil. The only think we know that can rival oil is nuclear energy but it has problems of its own.

All chemical energy available through coal and oil stored in the earth is the product of a massive amount of highly ineffecient capture of energy from sunlight. [0] All wind is caused directly by unequal warming of our planet through sunlight. The average hurricane individually releases more energy than entire world population has exhausted, since the dawn of time. [1] Sunlight is plenty enough. The problem is cheap,…

Another problem is energy density as I said. How much solar energy can you harvest from one square kilometer? I am so surprised that people just handwave this basic fundamental limits away and don't realize that we would have to build solar panels on an enormous percentage of planet for it to be able to replace fossil fuels.

Also managing the lifecycle and production of these panels is another issue. And don't forget that you still need to grow crops somewhere.

Currently only less than 2 % of the energy we use comes from solar energy and 87 % comes from fossil fuels. The cost of replacing the infrastructure is enormous and there is not much incentive to do it as long as we have plenty of cheap oil (which is going to stay with us for at least another century according to estimates).

Why is it so unimaginable that we will still be using oil in 100 years? It might not be 87 % as it is today, it might be 30 % but I am very sceptical that we will be able to completely replace the infrastructure we have build in the last 200 years.

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#106
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not expect that we will be able to move past fossil fuels in the next 100 years. There is simply no other source of energy with as much density and as convenient as oil. The only think we know that can rival oil is nuclear energy but it has problems of its own.

There is no pretense that a non-fossil fuel vehicle must have an energy density >= oil for it to be a viable alternative. A bicycle doesn't carry any energy at all and yet many people use them in place of a car.

I am still waiting for flying bicycles.

Also, why do you mention only vehicles? 87 % of ALL the energy we use comes from fossil fuels (coal + gas + oil).

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#107

Most of what I've read lately seems to indicate climate change can't be mitigated through societal restraint at this point. I think we need to seriously approach an engineered solution akin to terraforming. I'd love to know what efforts are being made in this direction.

>we need to seriously approach an engineered solution We haven't tried the political solution yet. Since limiting carbon emissions is the cheapest and easiest solution to climate change, it would be a good start to have politicans serve the people's interest instead of the fossil fuel ones, don't you think?

What are the people's interests here? Selfishly, I happen to like driving my car. Cheap gasoline is in my interest. What needs to be served to tackle climate change politically is the global greater good. We don't have a great track record with global anything in politics, nor do we have a great track record on serving the greater good, so I don't like those odds.

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#108
post #24

Also relevant: Feeding dairy cows seaweed mitigates the amount of methane they pass. Irish famers are beginning to do this because seaweed is easy to come by in Ireland. https://phys.org/news/2018-05-seaweed-relieve-gassy-cows-dai...

Hackernews loves these articles that give some kind of hope for a magical solution to climate change. It's easier than the thought that it will require a huge concerted effort across the world and changing the habits of millions

Getting farmers to change their ways will be a huge concerted effort that will change the habits of millions.

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#109
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All chemical energy available through coal and oil stored in the earth is the product of a massive amount of highly ineffecient capture of energy from sunlight. [0] All wind is caused directly by unequal warming of our planet through sunlight. The average hurricane individually releases more energy than entire world population has exhausted, since the dawn of time. [1] Sunlight is plenty enough. The problem is cheap,…

Another problem is energy density as I said. How much solar energy can you harvest from one square kilometer? I am so surprised that people just handwave this basic fundamental limits away and don't realize that we would have to build solar panels on an enormous percentage of planet for it to be able to replace fossil fuels. Also managing the lifecycle and production of these panels is another issue. And don't forget…

> Another problem is energy density as I said. How much solar energy can you harvest from one square kilometer? I am so surprised that people just handwave this basic fundamental limits away and don't realize that we would have to build solar panels on an enormous percentage of planet for it to be able to replace fossil fuels.

What are you talking about? From Elon Musk's TED talk, this is the area of solar panels required to power all of the US.

http://sustainsubstance.org/images/storage/2015-musk-bluesqu...

Re: Seaweed could be scrubbing more carbon from the atmosphere than expected (2017)

#110
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hackernews loves these articles that give some kind of hope for a magical solution to climate change. It's easier than the thought that it will require a huge concerted effort across the world and changing the habits of millions

I don't see anyone claiming the existence of or holding their breath for a magic solution. All I see is people sharing discoveries that might contribute towards a solution. Reducing the emissions caused by cattle can be a part of the "huge concentrated effort across the world" you mentioned.

Sure, but there is a solution that is orders of magnitude more effective: don't buy meat, thereby allowing cow farming to end.

Not eating meat is however seen as too 'inconvenient' a solution, so instead someone is trying to sell seaweed fed cows as a "partial solution" where it is really more of a gimmick.

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