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Introducing Android 9 Pie

android-developers.googleblog.com

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Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#211

Post by kllrnohj »

pjmlp wrote: post #60
mmastrac wrote: post #4

One of the quieter features of Android 9 is that they are reducing the API surface of Android by explicitly black-listing and white-listing various APIs and fields that previously required reflection to access. None of these APIs were documented, but none of them were explicitly "off limits" before Android P. That suggests that the life of Java as Android's primary language might be really coming to an end, even thou…

Apparently you haven't been paying attention, declaring off limits APIs started with Android Nougat for NDK developers. Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers, only the POSIX subset and Android public native APIs. Likewise with Java, which is only a subset of proper Java. In any case, it might relate more to an eventual future support of Java 9 module system, where private really…

> Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers, only the POSIX subset and Android public native APIs.

That's not even slightly true? Android doesn't pretend to be anything but a Linux system, with all the Linux details shining through in all their glory.

There is a seccomp policy that blacklists some syscalls, but it's only 17 out of 271 for ARM64 and it's things like setuid or reboot which you won't have permission to do anyway. Other than that you're completely free to go nuts with raw syscalls, you're in no way, shape, or form stuck going through a POSIX layer.

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#212

Post by ehsankia »

Legogris wrote: post #129
ppeetteerr wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They already do this with your searches and geolocation data. Why not this?

I can still dodge those by disabling Location Services and using something else than Google app-wise. It is not clear how opt-out this will be. Even if it can be disabled today it might become pushed harder as time goes.

You can disable this too: Home Settings > Suggestions

I believe the computation is done fully locally, as for "tracking", every single OS has a history of what applications you've launched recently, how is that any different?

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#213

Post by jhasse »

scarface74 wrote: post #178
youseecomrade wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I only use Android with ROMs like LineageOS where I can block apps from opening on startup and running in the background (you also get more granular permissions for free).

Why does Snapchat need to run at all when you’re not using it?

To ruin your battery life.

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#214

Post by ehsankia »

izacus wrote: post #83
Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #75

Surprised not to see mention of the cutout stuff yet. It seems pretty dumb to me that Google is jumping on board with this ridiculous feature. Maybe this'll be one of those Dropbox-style HN comments which in hindsight looks misled, but I honestly can't find any redeeming factors to the cutout idea.

Except developers being able to properly support their apps around it? OEMs have decided to add notches, want it or not. Not having a API to work with them would be a huge pain.

The purpose of AOSP Android has always been to lower fragmentation. If every OEM implements their own notch handling, then apps have no chance to properly support every single implementation. Google providing a standard way will greatly help the ecosystem. To give a really awful analogy, think of providing clean needles to drug addicts. It doesn't necessary mean you approve, but the benefits are bigger.

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#216

Post by solarkraft »

jmgao wrote: post #162
mmastrac wrote: post #4

One of the quieter features of Android 9 is that they are reducing the API surface of Android by explicitly black-listing and white-listing various APIs and fields that previously required reflection to access. None of these APIs were documented, but none of them were explicitly "off limits" before Android P. That suggests that the life of Java as Android's primary language might be really coming to an end, even thou…

That's a bizarre conclusion to come to. The real motivation is that if you know apps are reflecting into your internal implementation details, and you want to make a change, you're stuck with a bunch of bad choices. 1. Break the apps. Users tend to get annoyed when they upgrade the OS and their apps stop working. 2. Maintain a compatibility shim. Depending on what the change you're making does, this might not even be…

Break the apps. Undocumented APIs can not be relied on.

Of course it's a shame they were available/undocumented in the first place, but at least they are finally fixing this.

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#217

Post by Anon1096 »

knuththetruth wrote: post #205
Latteland wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe they claim they aren't really doing that. It could be the great negative attention forced them to say that wasn't their actual plan.

They said the same thing about their participation in the drone program, until an internal revolt forced them to reveal their true hand (they were actually doing it and hoping to do more of it), and subsequent internal backlash put a stop to it altogether. https://jacobinmag.com/2018/06/google-project-maven-military... I too hope that Googlers block what their execs are planning to do in China, but we're not there ye…

Google didn't try to hide that they were working with the Pentagon to better identify targets. Their participation was well known and in the open.

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#218

Post by sidlls »

j_coder wrote: post #188

It is amazing how each new version of Android has a complete new UX and none of them are actually good. Google is basically a back-end company incapable of doing good UX (if it is more than a search bar).

I have a more negative view. The entire Android development experience is substandard from front to back. The entire framework feels over engineered and bloated no matter which system or API it is.

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#219

Post by nine_k »

Avamander wrote: post #185
pjmlp wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently you haven't been paying attention, declaring off limits APIs started with Android Nougat for NDK developers. Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers, only the POSIX subset and Android public native APIs. Likewise with Java, which is only a subset of proper Java. In any case, it might relate more to an eventual future support of Java 9 module system, where private really…

> Because Linux APIs were never really intended to be called by NDK developers But pretty much all the "unintended" uses of Android APIs (undocumented or not) have been the most original and best-integrating apps I've seen. It's a pity.

Would you please offer an example of such an app and its outstanding features?

Re: Introducing Android 9 Pie

#220

Post by scarface74 »

kcmp wrote: post #128
Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #75

Surprised not to see mention of the cutout stuff yet. It seems pretty dumb to me that Google is jumping on board with this ridiculous feature. Maybe this'll be one of those Dropbox-style HN comments which in hindsight looks misled, but I honestly can't find any redeeming factors to the cutout idea.

People loved it when Apple did it which gave everyone else the okay to go ahead and do it themselves. It allows phone manafacturers to advertise higher screen to body ratios and is really just a step in the progression towards bezelless phones. There's definitely a loud group of people who strongly dislike it but I think most people are okay with it

People didn’t “love it” they tolerated it
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