How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind • Hacker News Board

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#251

Post by jschwartzi » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:08 PM UTC

JamesBarney wrote: post #203

neuland wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the problem is toxic home environments though, why aren't people suggesting that we cut out the middle man and focus on building a better foster / adoption system and encouraging people to use it? It seems that everyone is recognizing this is the problem, but the solutions all revolve around school, when it really doesn't have anything to do with schools. Edit: Or boarding schools.

Because it is really hard to compete with the love a parent, even a really shitty one.

It's not even really that. Your home environment sets your barometer for what normal life looks like and for how strangers can be expected to behave. If your parents fight and assume ill intent in every mistake then you see that in every interaction. If they're constantly trying to get one over on each other then that's how you see human relationships. They don't have to love you or be particularly invested in you for you to learn some really screwed up lessons from them.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#252

Post by s73v3r_ » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:09 PM UTC

whack wrote: post #45

elsherbini wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked for 2 years as an AmeriCorps volunteer in Atlanta Public Schools. I'll preface this by saying I don't know if I believe charter schools are bad or good, but here are some arguments against them: - Charter schools take money away from neighborhood public schools. Most schools are funded per-capita, so fewer students means less money. But many costs are fixed/discrete (e.g. school nurse costs N thousand dollar…

That's a pretty good summary of the common anti-charter arguments. A few counter-arguments to the above: - Charter schools expand choice for low-income families. If your public school sucks and your family is doing well, you can always move elsewhere or go to private school. If you're from a poor family, charter schools are your only escape valve - Maybe it's bad for the public school, but it's good for the high perf…

"Charter schools expand choice for low-income families."

Only if charter schools are not permitted to pick and choose who attends.

"Maybe it's bad for the public school, but it's good for the high performing students themselves, who are no longer dragged down by disruptive/disengaged classmates."

This kinda boils down to "fuck you, I've got mine." It's why no one likes libertarians.

"The vast majority of charter schools are non-profit."

Citation needed. And a citation that they're actually non-profit, and not a non-profit in the same way the NFL is a non-profit.

"They just happen to experiment with different approaches and methods, while giving students/parents the final say on where they want to go."

Yeah, but many times those "experiments" have to do with just breaking unions.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#253

Post by s73v3r_ » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:09 PM UTC

gedy wrote: post #235

elsherbini wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked for 2 years as an AmeriCorps volunteer in Atlanta Public Schools. I'll preface this by saying I don't know if I believe charter schools are bad or good, but here are some arguments against them: - Charter schools take money away from neighborhood public schools. Most schools are funded per-capita, so fewer students means less money. But many costs are fixed/discrete (e.g. school nurse costs N thousand dollar…

> Charter schools take money away from neighborhood public schools Such a lie/distortion

How is it a lie? Money going to charters is money not going to the neighborhood school.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#254

Post by antsar » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:09 PM UTC

PantaloonFlames wrote: post #245

roland35 wrote: post #50

I am excited about this approach and I think LeBron's organization has put a lot of though and work with experts on this project. - This school is a true public school and not a charter school. In Ohio a lot of charter schools can have some degree of selection in their students and kick out families which don't meet the requirements which leads to more at-risk students left to the public schools. This school is makin…

> I am not trying to blame the parents in all the cases either, a lot of the time there are single parents just trying to get by and make ends meet and don't know what more they can do. If there is a household with one parent, 5+ children, and not enough beds for them, the problem has occurred long before. One cannot blame the parent for "that day", but certainly the adult bears some responsibility for creating such…

Isn't it possible that "income, or stability" experienced a sudden drastic change at some point after birthing the 5th kid? It is conceivable that the parent did not have full control over that change.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#255

Post by dalbasal » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:12 PM UTC

BurningFrog wrote: post #72

Nokinside wrote: post #39

Elizabeth Warren pointed out that the US housing crisis was partly caused by inflated house prices in good public school districts. Middle income families were paying the education of their children in high property price. Maybe LeBron should invest into the property around the school to reap some of the benefits and use them to finance the school. Holistic property development.

Warren is not a great thinker on Economics issues. Good or bad school districts only change the relative prices. It doesn't alter the total amount of housing per population. In other words, anyone moving to a house in a good school district leaves an empty house in a worse one.

I don't think it's an uneducated answer, but even reasonable ideas in economics are generally somewhat speculative.

It is a scarcity, after all. Scarcities can have net different economic consequences.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#256

Post by danans » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:13 PM UTC

pbreit wrote: post #142

rory096 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No doubt! I definitely don't mean to denigrate the project at all, it's an incredibly philanthropic move by LeBron and he deserves every ounce of the praise he's been getting. I just see a lot of people using the "public school" line as a cudgel to bash charter schools, but charter schools are exactly the mechanism to accomplish something like this for people who aren't revered/rich enough to exercise the kind of inf…

What prevents non-charter/magnet schools from doing such things?

Non-charter/magnet publicly funded schools cannot select/reject children based on their demographics or aptitude. The most they can do is have a preference based on locality or the presence of a sibling in the school - which can and does introduce its own selection bias.

Ultimately, the public school system has to serve students who have been excluded from more selective schools, otherwise you end up as a society where the most basic education is a privilege instead of a right.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#257

Post by vxNsr » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:13 PM UTC

JamesBarney wrote: post #199

e40 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Others fall asleep immediately at school since they live with 5+ siblings and there are literally no available beds at home. I am not trying to blame the parents in all the cases either At some point, though, personal responsibility has to come into play. Having 5+ children when you have no resources... this is the true elephant in the room. It seems talking about it gets labels thrown around. I guess it's a conversa…

Are you arguing for better access to birth control? Or that the children should be punished for the sins of their mother?

Someone might argue that people shouldn't engage in activities that have a strong probability of creating responsibilities they can't handle, no matter how good those initial activities feel.

In other parts of society we'd say "Don't do the crime if you can't do the time."

I know this is a very unpopular opinion the world over right now, but: This applies loosely to sex as well (Don't have sex if you can't afford to have kids).

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#258

Post by eagsalazar2 » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:14 PM UTC

PantaloonFlames wrote: post #245

roland35 wrote: post #50

I am excited about this approach and I think LeBron's organization has put a lot of though and work with experts on this project. - This school is a true public school and not a charter school. In Ohio a lot of charter schools can have some degree of selection in their students and kick out families which don't meet the requirements which leads to more at-risk students left to the public schools. This school is makin…

> I am not trying to blame the parents in all the cases either, a lot of the time there are single parents just trying to get by and make ends meet and don't know what more they can do. If there is a household with one parent, 5+ children, and not enough beds for them, the problem has occurred long before. One cannot blame the parent for "that day", but certainly the adult bears some responsibility for creating such…

Why should we be clear about that? You know it is just turtles all the way down right? The goal here is to break a _cycle_ which this school is hopefully going to do by focusing constructively on what works to help these kids be better parents themselves one day. Beyond deepening our understanding of helping these kids I'd actually argue scrutinizing the parents has only negative utility and should be avoided at all costs (unless vilifying poor/uneducated parents feels useful to you as an end unto itself).

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#259

Post by s73v3r_ » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:14 PM UTC

berbec wrote: post #43

sjg007 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess one solution is that we then get charter schools that cater to special needs students.. we sort of have these programs already with center based autism "schools". However, going down this path will eventually run into Brown vs board of education.

How do charter schools not do that already? No skin in the game here, but isn't getting rid of special schooling the whole point of eliminating separate yet equal?

Depending on the state, there's no requirement for charters to accept everyone like a normal public school.

Re: How LeBron James' new public school is the first of its kind

#260

Post by gremlinsinc » Wed, Aug 01, 2018, 5:15 PM UTC

whatshisface wrote: post #209

gremlinsinc wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I said buy up, fix up, and rent out (at the same rent as before, but beautifying the neighborhood more) thus raising property value.

If the property value goes up the rent will go up, because nobody will be willing to invest in capital construction or home management unless they can make their money back.

Why not create community 'owned' housing, similar to a worker co-op, where poorer communities collectively 'own' the location. Everyone pays area-rental fees, but each month rented = 1 share ownership. Once the mortgage is paid off, the rent goes towards buying more rental properties and rinsing/repeating. A % of all rents is divided out by shares to each renter or ex-renter. A % could also go to LeBron's public school as a donation.

Obviously the longer you stay at a place and the smaller the place the more shares you'd have in the place. Shares could also = voting rights on properties/etc... More votes = louder voice.

Think of it as privatized (not government-ran) socialism in the real estate market.