‘Lopping,’ ‘Tips’ and the ‘Z-List’: Bias Lawsuit Explores Harvard’s Admissions

I don't think that's always the case but the important distinction is classism is legal, racism isn't.

> The outcome is racist but there's no intent to be racist.

Then why do college admissions factor in race at all?

> Their grades and scores are STELLAR!

But the complaint is that their grades and scores aren't stellar. That lower grades and scores are being chosen over higher grades and scores based apparently on race.

> What's going to happen to campus social life if half the class has a history of not being social at all?

Once again, the complaint is that people with equal or better extracurricular activities and better grades are being passed over based on race.

> No one is out to discriminate against asian people, their applications are just very problematic at scale.

But we know this isn't true. We know that college admins have discriminated before.

Your argument is just a rehash of the anti-semitic discrimination against jews decades ago.

https://www.businessinsider.com/the-ivy-leagues-history-of-d...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2018/06/18/harvard-ad...

It's pretty much boilerplate word for word copy of previous racist admission policies.

> It seems getting into America's most prestigious institution on merit is incredibly unlikely, compared to if you happened to have rich relatives.

It's mostly prestigious for business. Not saying it's right, but business is almost entirely who you know. The allure of Harvard is networking and name recognition. For tech, you can make amazing contacts at CMU, CalTech, MIT, etc and there systems are at least partially more of a meritocracy.

>Athletes I guess are a special American thing where universities are involved.

While it might be a raw deal for basketball or football where there is a ton of revenue, this is amazing for athletes of less popular sports like swimming, track and field, softball, etc. Also, athletics give people an outlet. It's at least partially why people walk on with no scholarship.

> You can't work your way out of poverty over two generations. If anything is the American Dream (arguably there's more people outside of America who have one of these, but I digress), it's being able to see your kids succeed. But they want 1st gen immigrants according to the article.

Granted this was a few years back, but parents were 1st gen from an Eastern European country. It helped me in the admissions process at a top tech school.

>Do they have a drop-down for ethnicity?

Yes, but pretty vague (e.g; White, Pacific Islander, Asian, etc). I wrote about my parents in my admission essay. I honestly think it helped me get into the school I wanted to go to. I'm not disagreeing the system is shitty, but where you go to school isn't as important as building your network in the US. The school on my resume may have gotten me some first interviews but the people I met at jobs have gotten me every other one. I'm not a super social person, so I never liked playing this game, but people liking you is far more important than what you actually know or where you went to school most of the time.

"What's going to happen to campus social life if half the class has a history of not being social at all?"

Sorry but what makes you think students with stellar grades have no social life? My memory of my four years at an "elite" NYC high school is that the students with the best grades (I was not even close) were just as social as the rest of us and participated in plenty of after school clubs and whatnot (more than I did).

"Who's going into investment banking to pull down big bonuses 10 years from now?"

Ironically that is a career path with a reputation for attracting anti-social psycopaths (but maybe this is a myth -- after all, Harvard admissions committees are there to find the applicants who proved their pro-social personalities by participating in exactly the sort of extracurriculars Harvard is looking for).

"No one is out to discriminate against asian people, their applications are just very problematic at scale."

The simple version of that sentence would be of the form, "I am not racist, but [racist statement]."

> - You can't work your way out of poverty over two generations. If anything is the American Dream (arguably there's more people outside of America who have one of these, but I digress), it's being able to see your kids succeed. But they want 1st gen immigrants according to the article.

I’m not following or think I disagree. Plenty of people (me and my siblings included) have gone from poverty to upper middle class in two generations. My grandfathers were literally a coal miner and a steel mill worker in rural Western PA. My parents were the first generation to attend college. My siblings and most of my cousins have achieved solid middle class or better in general.