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Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

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Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#21

Post by cozuya »

anon284271 wrote: post #9

I believe (vanilla) software development is a young man's/woman's game. I realized this last year at age 38 and I've been rapidly trying to alter my career trajectory. - If you aren't a specialist, you are constantly competing against 20-somethings who will always be more current in their skills and breadth than yourself, because they have more free time than you have (e.g. I have a wife, kid) - I've written GUI widg…

I have the opposite experience to be honest. I'm 42 and don't see anyone being way ahead of me due to their age or stamina. Maybe its because I didn't start this career until my mid 30s though.

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#22

Post by some_account »

anon284271 wrote: post #9

I believe (vanilla) software development is a young man's/woman's game. I realized this last year at age 38 and I've been rapidly trying to alter my career trajectory. - If you aren't a specialist, you are constantly competing against 20-somethings who will always be more current in their skills and breadth than yourself, because they have more free time than you have (e.g. I have a wife, kid) - I've written GUI widg…

You could easily go into Business Intelligence. That area is full of consultants who get tons of cash for just knowing a single database or application and spending their days at customers helping them use it properly.

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#23

Post by taf2 »

Wat!?!? Ok I’m 37- but like why would I ever need to stop pwning nubs? Hack and slash for life bro!

If anything I know more now about solving problems and handling stress. Likewise, everyone I work with who is older than me I have crazy respect for ageism is so silly

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#24

Post by artsyxxx »

kqr2 wrote: post #15
artsyxxx wrote: post #8

Fellows, grey bias, impostor syndrome, burnout, toxicity, anxiety and the others are all symptoms of the rigid mindstate that permeates our industry. It has to do with the curse of comfort and a lack of emotional agility which is exceptionally pronounced in this industry for many reasons which I shall not accentuate here except to state that `casual` is another word for `toxic` in my view. I would care to suggest to…

Non-shortened link: https://smile.amazon.com/Emotional-Agility-Unstuck-Embrace-C...

Very kind of you to provide this link; highly interested to know your take on this work.

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#25

Post by artsyxxx »

anon284271 wrote: post #9

I believe (vanilla) software development is a young man's/woman's game. I realized this last year at age 38 and I've been rapidly trying to alter my career trajectory. - If you aren't a specialist, you are constantly competing against 20-somethings who will always be more current in their skills and breadth than yourself, because they have more free time than you have (e.g. I have a wife, kid) - I've written GUI widg…

Younger developers are way more naive and out to prove their skills by engaging in any fool's errand they are presented with. Older folks have a lot of heuristics and experience that pushes them away from conventional collaboration and makes them unwilling to engage in negative work or emotional labour.

There is definitely a middle ground, I believe emotional agility is at the heart of 'true' agility and the emotions have been highly overlooked by people who either master the art of bottling it up (looking at you former managers) or brooding (that's on me and many of us I believe)

The middle ground is becoming aware of the spectrum of unpleasant emotions and learning to feel in more depth while using intellect to guide your own actions.

For example, one can sense disgust at a certain codebase. That's perfectly acceptable, and it doesn't have to be anyone's fault. The disgust will drive us to want to improve it. Unfortunately, our managers tell us `bottle up your disgust and do some more disgusting things so we can ship` in which case young guys jump to the challenge and old guys tend to feel completely undervalued.

Edit: this statement is intentionally opinionated. It's alright to have an emotional reaction to it. I'd be interested to know what emotions it evokes in the reader.

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#26

Post by steve1011 »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #13

Is there discrimination at the average company against 35+ candidates? Yes. Is it because the candidates don’t know the latest languages and frameworks? Sometimes, not always. Is it because “fresh grads” have “energy” or something? Almost certainly not. What does that even mean? Is it negated by the comments here like “oh there are 70-year-olds doing programmig where I work!”? No, that’s just an anecdote, not statist…

Where is your evidence then?

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#27

Post by avgDev »

I'm 31, my company also contracts a dev that is almost 60. He knows much more than me about architecture, old systems that we still use, I would not want to do his work. I work on the newer stuff.

As I get older I plan to shift to a different role. Maybe management, I am waiting for a position to open in a city for a dev project manager. I'm not really concerned.

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#28

Post by kbrisso »

artsyxxx wrote: post #24
kqr2 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Non-shortened link: https://smile.amazon.com/Emotional-Agility-Unstuck-Embrace-C...

Very kind of you to provide this link; highly interested to know your take on this work.

Thank you for sharing book. I am always looking for interesting stuff to read.

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#29

Post by mabynogy »

Ken Thomson and Rob Pike still program. They are inspiring people I wanna follow not those useless and inefficient bureaucrats in charge of "human resources".

As programmers, we should take the control of the recruitment with coopting. The market is in our favor. We are more needed than we need. We can do that smoothly and the good business men will understand they can save a lot of money with a such system.

I already know few good programmers who are available and I can recommend.

Re: Ask HN: Is software engineering really a dead-end job after 35-40?

#30

Post by runjake »

As a gray-haired programmer who happens to be on interview teams, I interview a lot of older candidates along with a team of younger professionals.

It's not so much their age, but rather they have a tendency to be set in their ways, are less eager to learn and explore and change.

On a personal level, I'm impressed you've stuck with Perl all these years, and I'd love to nerd out with you over a beer later. On a professional level, I'm wondering if you're an inflexible curmudgeon.

Also as an older person, you're going to be expected to have some good basic management skills and wisdom. It's just the course of human nature.

Another couple of anti-bias tactics:

1. Dress nicely and modern. I see a lot of candidates who wear a suit that looks like its been slept in, or it looks like a suit they bought in the 80s. I'm not telling you to wear skinny jeans and Supreme shirts, but just dress relatively clean and modern.

You can get away with a lot on this front as a youngster, but it really works against you once you become one of us grays.

2. Stay fit/eat right. It doesn't do you any well if you're old, and overweight, and breathing hard during the interview.

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