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Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

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Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#271

When is this overhype for Slack going to stop? It is a chat application with a slightly improved UI like it existed 30 years ago. This is a step in corporate IT that I really cannot fully understand. It seems that every company//startup has to use slack nowadays to pretend to be cool again. Everytime I have a serious conversation about the productivity gains or losses of Slack though, it is pretty clear to me that it…

> When is this overhype for Slack going to stop?

I challenge you to consider whether your perspective applies to the 99% of people who use Slack that are not developers writing software. For those people, email is often not a place where well-argued discussions happen. It's usually a place where chat-like communication happens, slowly, and in an ill-fitting interface. For non-developers, let's take a operations associate for example or a logistics manager, or someone else whose job is to coordinate and communicate frequently, Slack plays a very different role than it does for devs.

Unfortunately for you, and others like you who don't like Slack, if 99% of your company wants to use it, you'll almost certainly get pulled in. Unless your department or team explicitly opts-out, you'll get pulled into the same platform the rest of the company is using.

This isn't to say you're wrong -- just to say that we must not judge the hype around Slack, or it's clear successes, as a fad if we're only judging it based on the experiences of the kinds of people who frequent HN.

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#272
post #26

I've never really gotten into any of Atlasssian's products. It seems like they make tools for managers with bolt on functionality for engineers (which may be why I never caught onto their products). I hope this is good news for Slack, but as a software engineer today, Atlasssian's products are not the first ones I would recommend in any category.

   It seems like they make tools for managers with bolt on functionality for engineers 
Yep. And who are the people who decide what project management software to use?

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm firmly in the "email has no place in internal discussions whatsoever" camp. Tasks belong in tickets, long-term documentation/policies/meeting notes/etc belong in shared space (wiki), and discussions are faster and more productive in realtime (in-person, video call, or chat). E-mail might kick some of this off, or be used to schedule, but that should be it. The problem I think most people run into with the realtim…

Your suggestions may work inside a company. E-mail is the only federated system we've left. If you need to contact somebody outside it, you're screwed. XMPP/Jabber could have solved some of this, but it's pretty dead right now.

The org I work for has a bunch of Slack channels that we invite our clients into as single channel guests (If they don't already use Slack). We have Gov & corporate using it without issue and they love it.

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Email is crap for many types of workflows that Slack excels in.

It’s too bad most of those workflows don’t apply to business use cases. Is it a chat client? A knowledge base? A conference call? A command line? Who knows!

> It’s too bad most of those workflows don’t apply to business use cases.

Which is totally why Slack isn't popular with businesses. /s

Just because you personally haven't found it useful, doesn't mean hundreds of thousands of other business users haven't.

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#275

Interesting. I worked at a healthcare tech startup last year and the reason why we had to use Hipchat is because the self-hosted Hipchat Server was HIPAA-compliant and Slack does not have a HIPAA-compliant self-hosted option. Have no idea what they're going to do (or anyone who needs to comply with stricter regulatory guidelines that prevents use of cloud-based messaging apps).

Shameless self-promotion: We (Trillian) just received HITRUST certification, provide a BAA, and offer both a SaaS variant and the self-hosted Trillian Server product, both of which run over our own open IM protocol. We're not exactly a Slack/Hipchat clone (having been around for 18+ years, we're more of a traditional IM and group chat solution with some modern stuff like an API, chat bots, and federation capabilities…

I still remember (and may still have an installer for...) Trillian back in the days when it was just a multi-IM client.

I like your pricing comparisons for on-premises servers - particularly the comparison to a Skype for Business site license. https://trillian.im/uses/self-hosted-instant-messaging/

Am I correct that you're pretty much focused on just the IM/chat side of things rather than all the calendar/phone/build system/coffeepot/refrigerator integrations that Slack seems to talk up?

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#276
I don't know if Stride was losing out to Slack, or if it was losing out to the FOSS competitors like Rocket, Mattermost, and Zulip. I've found Rocket and Mattermost to work well for small teams (no experience with medium or big deployments).

With the FOSS alternatives plus the more fringe competitors like Ryver, Glip, and Twist, plus related tools from Dropbox, Basecamp, etc., it's hard to see there being a market for Stride.

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#277

Huge problem for on-prem Hipchat customers. Plenty of customers out there not willing to put all their internal communications on the other side of their firewall, and now have to migrate. Slack doesn't have an on-prem option. Microsoft Teams doesn't have an on-prem option. What are enterprises supposed to use, RocketChat? Matrix? With no clear migration path? Really poor move on Atlassian's part. It would be one thi…

Skype for Business, works on prem. Matrix is probably good too. Confluence can be installed on prem already.

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#278
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Taking out a competitor is good for Slack, said Butterfield: “There’s fewer choices for people.”"

Really surprised that a CEO would make a comment like that on the record.

Slack's competitors include Google, Microsoft, and Facebook. You can say that all of those companies have terrible products if you want (Hangouts, Teams, and FB for Work), but all have been positioned to act as Slack alternatives.

I don't think Slack is worried about looking anti-competitive in that crowd.

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#279
post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going through all of your channels you don't need immediate updates from and doing /mute will go a long way to getting the silence you want. People can still @mention you to get your attention if needed. You can check muted channels on your own time when you feel like it. You should also set up Do not Disturb and turn off the red notification dots. The rest is a cultural problem that exists will all communication cha…

For some inexplicable reason, in the absurdly big Hack Reactor alumni slack, it's considered cool to scoff at people asking for conversations to be taken into threads. There's like 3000 people in there. Sometimes shitloads of conversations are happening at once. The people that refuse to use threads aren't cool, they're just co-opting literally the entire channel for just their conversation. I see it as a forum, wher…

Ask, don't scoff? Also to be fair, Slack's implementation of threads is awful. Probably their most poorly done feature in my mind.

If there is already a lively topic ongoing in a room and I need to jump in with another topic, I write a message and say "Hey I have a question, can someone help me?" and then I immediately start a thread with myself so people see that it is a thread and click it to respond rather than just spamming the room.

I have always wanted to try out twistapp and see how it is with their "Thread first" UX mentality.

Re: Slack Is Buying HipChat from Atlassian

#280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We use Slack now, and are looking to migrate to Mattermost (since we run GitLab already). We don't want to pay the price we'd need to pay to keep Slack, and plus we want to host our own.

We moved from Slack to Mattermost, and Mattermost is garbage. Messages are delivered late (by hours), if ever. You don't get notifications correctly. It takes seconds (more than 10 sometimes) to load a page. Sometimes the page goes blank. Much of our office has reverted to email and phone calls for many things that would have worked fine with Slack.

I'll counter that anecdote with an observation that I have never observed any of those issues. In our deployment Mattermost is reliable and I've never heard any complaints like those from my colleagues. It could be a question of scale; we only have probably 50 or so regular users.

That said, even though it works as advertised the product is not perfect. The Mattermost UI is bare bones and some things like conversation threading are implemented poorly.

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