MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros • Hacker News Board

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#551

Post by octorian » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:12 PM UTC

p49k wrote: post #369

r0fl wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They didn't do that because it is not what most people want. Apple has to make changes that will sell more laptops to the masses to maximize shareholder value. The niche developer/macrumors posters will never be happy regardless of what Apple does. Better to focus on the 90% of customers who buy products and make up 10% of the complaints then to focus on the 10% of customers who make up 90% of the complaints.

I don’t necessarily agree that it’s what most people want. I think the reason that most people keep buying macs is because of MacOS. It is so nice to have a UNIX-based OS with great UI, so we keep buying the overpriced, out-of-date, defective laptops because we have no other choice. I’m convinced that a solid, secure, reliable and polished Unix-based OS for developers would quickly wipe out a large segment of Apple’s…

I've long felt that the greatest threat to Linux on the desktop (for the past ~15 years) has been OSX, not Windows.

We all want a solid and reliable UNIX-based OS, but we also want an OS that won't be treated as a bastard child by hardware and software vendors. As much as we all love the world of free software, sometimes we actually do want/need to use commercial software as well.

Apple has given us what we fundamentally want, so we just put up with all the baggage that comes along with it. After all, what else are we going to do? Use Windows?

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#552

Post by eruci » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:12 PM UTC

And they will keep making the default HDD smaller so that you will subscribe to icloud for storage

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#553

Post by aeriklawson » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:14 PM UTC

r0fl wrote: post #36

no1youknowz wrote: post #20

> The new keyboard has the same dimensions and look as its two predecessors, but the keys feel just a little bit different. They're quieter, for one thing. They have a softer, less click-y feel that is a little closer to the pre-2016 models' chiclet keys. We found the new keyboard to be a little nicer to type on, but it's not a radical difference. It's unlikely to convert the detractors, but it's a welcome iteration…

They didn't do that because it is not what most people want. Apple has to make changes that will sell more laptops to the masses to maximize shareholder value. The niche developer/macrumors posters will never be happy regardless of what Apple does. Better to focus on the 90% of customers who buy products and make up 10% of the complaints then to focus on the 10% of customers who make up 90% of the complaints.

> They didn't do that because it is not what most people want.

Bingo. Most people on this site don't realize they are in the minority.

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#554

Post by rconti » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:14 PM UTC

This seems like a pretty unusual/rare step of releasing an upgrade with just a press release; they clearly wanted to get this machine out before some part of the buying cycle rather than waiting for a press event. I know it's still just a spec bump, but it's different enough that it would normally appear at an event.

I don't need to rehash all of the 2015 vs touchbar arguments, the touchbar machine is "good enough" that I like it as my work machine. But as my 2011 Air home "kitchen table" machine (128gb ssd/4gb RAM) is getting infuriatingly slow, I realized I don't have to decide between a Macbook or a Macbook Pro to replace it. Suddenly buying a gently used 2015 Macbook Pro to replace it seems like a killer idea. Not quite as svelte as my work machine, and nowhere near as light as the air, but for a versatile home/travel machine, having the great keyboard, USB ports, and most importantly, CHEAPER than a brand new one, would really sell me.

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#555

Post by octorian » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:17 PM UTC

nottorp wrote: post #116

_bxg1 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Macbook Pro has been the go-to software developer machine for years now, and that segment is seeing a massive exodus after the touch bar launch. I don't know how big a percentage that is of total sales, but it can't just be a trivial niche.

I'm holding on to my 2013 mbpro with a real keyboard, but if it dies... looks like they only have emoji keyboards now. I'll have to join the exodus then.

Same here. Well, that's my personal laptop which is perfectly fast and in great condition.

My work laptop was actually the same generation, until IT recently upgraded me to one of the new-keyboard models. I don't like how loud the keyboard is, and I don't like the touchbar. (sorry, I actually need to press "Esc" and also use non-beautifully-designed software that sometimes uses Fn keys.)

Needless to say, I have absolutely no desire to upgrade my personal laptop. When I do, I can only hope Apple has moved past this, or the F/OSS world has finally acknowledged that the touchbar actually needs to be supported.

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#556

Post by rbanffy » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:21 PM UTC

bunderbunder wrote: post #173

r0fl wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They didn't do that because it is not what most people want. Apple has to make changes that will sell more laptops to the masses to maximize shareholder value. The niche developer/macrumors posters will never be happy regardless of what Apple does. Better to focus on the 90% of customers who buy products and make up 10% of the complaints then to focus on the 10% of customers who make up 90% of the complaints.

> The niche developer/macrumors posters will never be happy regardless of what Apple does. Haven't done a survey, but quite a few folks I know who work at Mac shops report that their employers have been steering clear of the new MacBooks and just trying to keep the older models they already have alive, while also looking seriously into the feasibility of switching to PCs running Linux if they don't get their act toge…

> trying to keep the older models they already have alive

It's not a bad move - if you can maximize the return on DisplayPort monitors, USB keyboards, HDMI cables and MagSafe chargers, it makes sense. Keep in mind the company will eventually have to move to USB-C, as the MacBook Air is the only remaining MagSafe laptop and I won't bet on its longevity. OTOH, the old-style MBPs are enough for most uses, as are the Air for anyone who can live within 8GB.

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#557

Post by rc_bhg » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:22 PM UTC

coldseattle wrote: post #161

Pros need an escape key.

It's a very important key.

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#558

Post by Steltek » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:22 PM UTC

mschaef wrote: post #122

eej71 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The situation with emacs isn't much better!

Why do you say that? I've used emacs for years and use the escape key very infrequently. (Although I do swap control and caps lock, and have for years.)

At a guess, it's the layout of Ctrl and Alt on Mac keyboards. They're small and crammed right next to each other. It's physically painful to use Mac keyboards for Linux-y tasks and I don't understand people's love of them.

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#559

Post by octorian » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:23 PM UTC

gwbas1c wrote: post #103

no1youknowz wrote: post #20

> The new keyboard has the same dimensions and look as its two predecessors, but the keys feel just a little bit different. They're quieter, for one thing. They have a softer, less click-y feel that is a little closer to the pre-2016 models' chiclet keys. We found the new keyboard to be a little nicer to type on, but it's not a radical difference. It's unlikely to convert the detractors, but it's a welcome iteration…

Better yet, why don't they go back and grab the 2006 17" form factor? That was the best developer laptop I had. The missing 2" on the 15" just makes the IDE too narrow.

That was back in the day when you had to buy Apple's 17" model just to get the same number of pixels on your screen as everyone else's 15" model. Apple had worse density than the competition back then.

Then a few years passed, and Apple went all-in on high-DPI "Retina" displays, while the whole PC laptop world had a great display regression.

Re: MacBook Pro with faster performance and new features for pros

#560

Post by octorian » Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 4:25 PM UTC

slantyyz wrote: post #452

thanatropism wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep wanting to buy a 17" and then walking back from it after seeing/handling 17" laptops in physical stores. All the bezel-shrinking R&D being done for phones has to reach laptops at some point. I'm seriously losing half an inch of luggable-but-not-lookable space on each side of the screen, plus a good inch below. (I have like the most common 13" Dell in the world; just walking around in the study room of the libr…

The Apple 17" laptops were about the same size (maybe even smaller) as large 15" laptops though. Presumably, an Apple 17" laptop in this day and age would be pretty manageable size-wise.

I can definitely attest to this, having had one back in the day. Of course back then, everyone else made super-chunky laptops, at least with the cheaper models (so chunky that people bought netbooks because laptops were insufficiently portable.)

I frequently put Apple's 17" laptop in a backpack/case slot designed for 15" normal laptops, and it fit just fine.