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Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

nytimes.com

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Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#91

Post by make3 »

walrus01 wrote: post #21
wcrichton wrote: post #14

I’m a PhD student focusing on large scale video analysis. It’s an unfortunate fact that a lot of the applied research in this space is motivated by surveillance, particularly in systems, eg what’s come out of Microsoft’s efforts here [0]. A colleague who attended CVPR said most of the industry booths were either surveillance or self driving cars. I wish researchers would start to think more creatively about what we c…

> I wish researchers would start to think more creatively about what we can do with large video datasets and tools like face recognition. Some very smart people in China did exactly that, and arrived at a conclusion on what the local market for surveillance tech was lacking. Based on what the government will fund, they came up with an answer we seem to dislike.

I think he means, aside from dystopian population surveillance

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#92

Post by duxup »

sharpercoder wrote: post #46

I understand that most western countries have societal controls grown over the past centuries. The Chinese did not, and are catching up quickly by implementing similar controls as we have. But now, it's the digital age, and as such they are using any available technology to implement these societal controls. From this perspective, it's completely normal what the Chinese do. Seen from western eyes it does look a bit s…

"I understand that most western countries have societal controls grown over the past centuries. The Chinese did not"

What does that mean?

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#93

Post by andrepd »

peter303 wrote: post #23
walrus01 wrote: post #7

These tracking systems are being combined with China's "social credit score". You think Transunion, Experian and Equifax are creepy and wrong? Spend ten minutes researching this: https://www.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&q=chi... Cameras with facial recognition are the tip of the iceberg. Through sufficiently strong government legal control, metadata such as mobile phone GPS and tower data can be correla…

Sounds like Google Facebook and Amazon

In principle maybe. But the difference in degree is too large to allow such a comparison.

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#94

Post by make3 »

Tenoke wrote: post #5

The technology isn't quite there, and Chinese law enforcement clearly exaggerates in order to maximize the current impact. However, we are very close to the point where everything could be tracked, and recorded in a usable way - including the exact location of most citizens at all times, discrepancies in utility bills, shopping, internet activity (except possibly for those few with impeccable OpSec, and even that for…

the technology for face tracking/identification an action identification is definitely there?

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#96

Post by justicezyx »

walrus01 wrote: post #83
star-trek-fleet wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer: I don’t consider myself prochinese government, if you think the below statements state otherwise, don’t call me a 50cents party. There are freedom in expressing ones thoughts on solid facts. It’s an insult to people’s rights by labeling them and automatically disregard their opinions. I think our collective consciousness should be to show the world that a free and open nation is the best form of national…

(removed at the request of a site admin?)

Hmm, exactly as I imagined... :(

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#97

Post by ineednoprocrast »

wcrichton wrote: post #14

I’m a PhD student focusing on large scale video analysis. It’s an unfortunate fact that a lot of the applied research in this space is motivated by surveillance, particularly in systems, eg what’s come out of Microsoft’s efforts here [0]. A colleague who attended CVPR said most of the industry booths were either surveillance or self driving cars. I wish researchers would start to think more creatively about what we c…

I rarely post, but I feel it necessary to chime in here.

I studied computational linguistics/natural language processing in grad school, out of an interest in accessibility issues (I had RSI) and related applications, and had naively neglected to look very hard about how I'd be likely use it in a career.

Other people in my cohort went to work for the CIA. I couldn't move to the bay area for... reasons, (this was pre-Google) and it seemed everyplace I could find anything wanted me to have a security clearance, with all the implications that has.

One could say I'm not mercenary enough, or that I took too many philosophy classes, or any number of other rationalizations, but one way or another, none of the jobs I've taken have had much need for what I studied.

I feel morally obligated to use what I know to improve the state of the world. This has, unfortunately, led to a lot of unemployment and serious depression.

Pseudonym for obvious reasons.

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#98

Post by est »

wcrichton wrote: post #14

I’m a PhD student focusing on large scale video analysis. It’s an unfortunate fact that a lot of the applied research in this space is motivated by surveillance, particularly in systems, eg what’s come out of Microsoft’s efforts here [0]. A colleague who attended CVPR said most of the industry booths were either surveillance or self driving cars. I wish researchers would start to think more creatively about what we c…

> identify gender bias in modern cinema

Looks like a way to sell more ads.

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#99

Post by est »

peter303 wrote: post #23
walrus01 wrote: post #7

These tracking systems are being combined with China's "social credit score". You think Transunion, Experian and Equifax are creepy and wrong? Spend ten minutes researching this: https://www.google.com/search?client=ubuntu&channel=fs&q=chi... Cameras with facial recognition are the tip of the iceberg. Through sufficiently strong government legal control, metadata such as mobile phone GPS and tower data can be correla…

Sounds like Google Facebook and Amazon

Sound like when U.S. federal government owns Google, Facebook and Amazon combined.

Re: Inside China’s Dystopian Dreams: A.I., Shame and Lots of Cameras

#100

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

briandear wrote: post #27
tmalsburg2 wrote: post #2

The article says there are four times as many cameras in China than in the US. This means approximately the same number of cameras per citizen. Where is the NYT article about the US' dystopian dreams?

It’s not even close. A false equivalence. Assuming a camera represents a unit of surveillance, then that comparison might hold, but it’s what China actually does with that stuff that makes the difference. There is always this knee-jerk “What about the US?” every time there is an article like this. If you haven’t lived in China and actually lived within their system, it’s easy to take for granted the freedom Americans…

> Clandestine Christians in China have never been involved in the planning or execution of violent acts in China

Firstly, the Christian element to the Taiping Rebellion[0] is one reason why the Chinese state is wary of Christianity outside the carefully controlled state form that is permitted. Religion can obviously contribute to social unrest.

Secondly, house churches in China tend to promote the vision of a coming Kingdom of God that will do away with all the rulers of the world. Anywhere else in the world, that is viewed as an entirely mainstream aspect of Christian doctrine. However, the Chinese Communist Party sees this as an attack on their own authority, and so they want Christians to remain within the state church that downplays this doctrine.

With regard to this second point, it is not just Christianity. The same treatment applies for any other sociopolitical movement in China that envisions a future for the country without a place for the established Communist Party in it. It doesn’t matter if Christians are not advocating violence. The mere fact that they even question the everlasting authority of China’s authorities is already offensive enough to get them condemned.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion

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