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Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

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91–100 of 210 posts

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#91
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Companies do it at scale, though. And motivated by profits, not regard for 'good guy' or 'bad guy' status.

This doesn't really matter. You can do it at scale too, just spin up your NN on any of the cloud platforms available. Instant scale. The fact that amazon offers this recognition lowers the barrier hardly at all.

Sure you can spin up unlimited servers. But an individual doesn't have the resources to collect data from across the city at all times, which is where we really start getting into invasion of privacy.

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#92

> Amazon’s facial recognition service, Rekognition, is designed to identify and track people going about their daily business. This isn’t hyperbole - a Rekognition spokesperson explicitly mentioned real-time tracking and identification at an Amazon Web Services summit earlier this year. The same spokesperson went on to call Orlando a “smart city,” with cameras everywhere that allow authorities to track persons of int…

On track to achieving real life "1984"

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#93
post #64
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds funny, but this could actually happen. By entering the country you agree to give up your EU rights, or turn around and get back on the plane.

Yes, this is what happens. National sovereignty still exists. Maybe, since Europeans have a supra-national entity above their countries, they don't quite grok that everywhere else a country is the top giver of the law.

I doubt it’s particularly different to Americans having trouble with the idea that not everyone has the first or second amendments. Or, even, an explicit constitution.

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#94
post #85
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but I'm sure many of the people working on it will continue to deny that they are simply building tools of control. That, or they don't care, or think it's a good thing.

I'm honestly not sure how I feel about the expectation that employees and corporations act with some (or any) kind of morality beyond "make money legally". Philosophically I would rather laws and social norms are enforced by law and not corporations or individuals with disproportionate influence.

Are they not citizens? Surely a person has a duty above personal wealth. Past generations certainly thought that way.

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linux and Ethernet do not "Easily add intelligent image and video analysis to your applications."

Any image recognition API is likely to heavily rely on them. You can do positive things with Rekognition. You can do dystopian things with it, too. Get AWS to stop doing it and folks will just use GCP and Azure's similar offerings. This is a problem that fundamentally needs government regulation to be successfully addressed.

> You can do positive things with Rekognition.

[Citation needed]

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#96
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with some of the principles you're articulating here, but I think the general class of position you're taking here is a bad one. Free speech has an actual meaning. It means the government does not restrict speech. Tracking people does not restrict speech. It may impose a social cost on you for speaking, but it does not prevent you from doing so. Nowhere in the constitution of the United States, nor any consti…

I disagree that freedom of speech can be so neatly boxed into such a narrow definition, but that isn't really the point I was trying to make. Ignoring broader social issues and focusing purely on the government, citizen monitoring can be (and often is) utilized by governments to curtail free speech. People joke about the NSA monitoring them, but that absolutely has an impact on free speech - people are less likely to…

> Ignoring broader social issues and focusing purely on the government, citizen monitoring can be (and often is) utilized by governments to curtail free speech. People joke about the NSA monitoring them, but that absolutely has an impact on free speech

It has an impact on speech. It does not have an impact on freedom to speak. The fact that a social architecture changes behavior does not mean that it restricts it. This difference is important.

This does not mean that the right to anonymity is not important. It may well be. It just isn't the same thing as the right to free speech, and they shouldn't be conflated. I understand the desire to conflate them - anchoring the right to anonymity to the more recognized right of free speech gives it greater moral force. That's why people make arguments like that. But in so doing it lassoes the even more important right of actual free speech to the probably less important right of anonymous speech. It tethers them in a way that exposes the weaknesses of the lesser right to the greater one.

Free speech is the right to say whatever you want without government interference. The right to anonymity may be important to, but let it stand on its own.

> If the government can monitor which events you show up at or what you read, does that make you more likely to be put on a no-fly list? Does that make it more likely for the government to pursue a separate legal action that it otherwise might ignore?

Lots of things make you more or less likely to do various things. That is not the same as curtailing your right to do them. Changing organ donation from opt-in to opt-out increases the right at which people choose it. That is not the same thing as forcible organ harvesting.

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#97
post #83
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with some of the principles you're articulating here, but I think the general class of position you're taking here is a bad one. Free speech has an actual meaning. It means the government does not restrict speech. Tracking people does not restrict speech. It may impose a social cost on you for speaking, but it does not prevent you from doing so. Nowhere in the constitution of the United States, nor any consti…

Do not conflate "social consequences" with "police state consequences"

If the government is imposing consequences upon speech, then speech is not free.

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#98

As long as I or you can use it to track the coming and going of your Congressman and Senators, at the same price that Amazon charges others, I guess it is okay. That nice townhouse he visited with the attractive blonde who lives there, while his wife was out of town? It's ok for me to track and then publish the info, right? We're all equal when we are in public view, right?

But why do you care ?

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any image recognition API is likely to heavily rely on them. You can do positive things with Rekognition. You can do dystopian things with it, too. Get AWS to stop doing it and folks will just use GCP and Azure's similar offerings. This is a problem that fundamentally needs government regulation to be successfully addressed.

> You can do positive things with Rekognition. [Citation needed]

[Citation provided]

The NYT (and C-SPAN, apparently) uses it to identify members of Congress:

https://open.nytimes.com/how-the-new-york-times-uses-softwar...

Shutterfly is apparently using it for image categorization:

http://ir.shutterfly.com/news-releases/news-release-details/...

Re: Yes, Amazon Is Tracking People

#100

> Amazon’s facial recognition service, Rekognition, is designed to identify and track people going about their daily business. This isn’t hyperbole - a Rekognition spokesperson explicitly mentioned real-time tracking and identification at an Amazon Web Services summit earlier this year. The same spokesperson went on to call Orlando a “smart city,” with cameras everywhere that allow authorities to track persons of int…

as implemented in China: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fq1SEqNT-7c
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